4 ms·

Tim is a bean counter at heart and everything Apple has been marketing spin for decades.

eitland 5y ago
> everything Apple has been marketing spin for decades. After using Android since around 2010 getting a midrange iPhone around 18 or so months ago was almost a revelation for me, so no, it is clearly not all marketing spin. (Why? Even on a Note II or S7 Edge something as trivial as opening the camera would have me waiting. On my iPhone XR pressing the camera button brings up the camera more or less instantaneously. And there are also a number of small conveniences that are hard to really pinpoint like actually understanding when it is in my pocket and then not turn on and burn out my battery.)
- christophilus 5y ago
  It’s been a minute since I used Android, but I definitely felt the same when I switched to the iPhone. I found it a much more refined experience over all. That said, if there was a decent Linux phone, I’d hop on it, warts and all. Pinephone or Librem are getting close.
  - deregulateMed 5y ago
    I wonder if you got a garbage Android. Samsung is the Apple of Android. Big marketing budget, medium quality.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
- tsherr 5y ago
  On my ancient and overloaded S8, the camera loads in under a second after double tapping power. Battery lasts all day (and it's 4 years old). Doesn't turn on when it's in my pocket. These anecdotal "I switched to x and its waaay better" things always reek of bias. That a 2017 phone is slower than a 2018 phone is obvious - plus you'd need to reset the s7 to factory defaults for fair(er) comparison. I do support on iPhones (not an Apple employee) and I've never experienced the the vaunted "this is so much better" moment.
  - eldaisfish 5y ago
    your phone is the exception, not the norm. Apple are well known for choosing hardware that delivers a great user experience. Their choices may not cater to your specific requirements but their sales figures strongly indicate that the majority of people disagree with you. If you want to see how much value there is in Apple's phones, look at the used phone market. The competition isn't even close and iphones hold their value much better than the vast majority of android phones.
    - kevin_thibedeau 5y ago
      Android hardware isn't at fault. It's the bloated software stack written by Google devs only working on flagship phones.
    - falcrist 5y ago
      Are you sure its really the exception? I had an S6 that still functions really well with minimal battery degredation. I used it really heavily until I upgraded to an S9+, which is still going strong with pretty heavy use. I've used apple products too, but it sounds to me like the differences in quality are deeply exaggerated. I happen to like android mostly because I have access to the filesystem and like to tinker with settings (and I like using my headphone jack). As far as aftermarket value, I'm not convinced the used marked is completely rational... Or rather, there are plenty of confounding factors that make that a poor argument for which phone is built better.
      - eldaisfish 5y ago
        yes, your phone is the exception. There are numerically more exceptions because of the sheer number of android models out there but phones lasting longer than two or three years is the exception. You can see this on the estimated OS charts if you combine it with the knowledge that most android phones don't receive more than one OS update. I've had several android phones over the years and know several others who owned them as well. Both in developed and developing markets. Android phones are cheap and will suffer on two counts - software and hardware longevity. The used market may not be totally rational but there's a good case to be made for why apple devices tend to hold their value better - they are often built better. You cannot simply dismiss the higher price of used apple hardware as the market being irrational.
- usrusr 5y ago
  Apple has a camera button? (asking for an Xperia owner)
  - taylodl 5y ago
    You can set it up in the Control Center. That's how I access my camera.
  - eitland 5y ago
    Sorry, soft buttons. One on the lock screen and one in the home screen. And yes, as far as I remember Xperia was good, it just failed physically (later realized it was my fault as I used it as alarm clock and ended up applying force to the charging cable each morning.) Also they lost me as a customer when they included Amazon ads in a OS upgrade.
- deregulateMed 5y ago
  I went the other way. I got an iPhone in 2016 and was shocked at how poor the quality of hardware, os, and software was. Admittedly opening the box and giving Apple my personal information was fun. Maybe it was a bad time for Apple, but it was almost traumatic for me. They really did just use marketing to sell phones.
  - onethought 5y ago
    Which iPhone was 2016 and what was the quality issue of the hardware, os and software? Consistently Apple have been the leaders in all of the above. Even now, superior chip, camera, battery life, pixel density... it's hard to find better. I've used Pixels since they became a thing and Apple iPhones. Other than quirky App Store bugs the quality issues almost always occur on the Pixel phones. ("Ok google" just stopping, gestures just stopping, ringing phone not responding to touch etc).
    - deregulateMed 5y ago
      Hardware might be related to software. The swiping from screen to screen was slow. I posted about this and people said to turn off animations. Annoyingly this was not straightforward and it didn't solve the problem. Not to mention having a unique charger meant an extra device to pack on trips. The os annoyance was the relentless "type in your apple id password", and multiple times per week updates. A few users have spun the narrative that updates are good, but these were annoying and didn't have any front facing benefits. No widgets really sucked, it was regressive not to have my next alarm time on my home screen. Finally Apple maps sucked, the podcast app was buggy, I'd hit play and nothing would happen. I'd then hit play a few times and nothing would happen. Then finally something would happen. I can't remember other software bugs, it's been years. Sure these might be fixed today, but I wonder what other things are bad today. I have ad blocking and a few other non play store apps on my phone, given the App Store, I'm not sure Apple would let such apps through.
- WesleyHale 5y ago
  The Note II was released in 2012, and the S7 was released in 2016. To be fair, transitioning from any phone around the S7 era to an iPhone XR bought in 2020 would probably give you the same feeling of revelation. The longest I've held on to a phone was the iPhone 7 Plus for ~4 years, but even after 2 and a 1/2 years it was starting to show it's age. By the time I got rid of it, a charge would last me a little over half a day from moderate use.
OJFord 5y ago
At least Apple actually makes stuff, so many companies really are just marketing companies, 'their products' being complete commodity items.

> everything Apple has been marketing spin for decades. After using Android since around 2010 getting a midrange iPhone around 18 or so months ago was almost a revelation for me, so no, it is clearly not all marketing spin. (Why? Even on a Note II or S7 Edge something as trivial as opening the camera would have me waiting. On my iPhone XR pressing the camera button brings up the camera more or less instantaneously. And there are also a number of small conveniences that are hard to really pinpoint like actually understanding when it is in my pocket and then not turn on and burn out my battery.)

christophilus 5y ago
It’s been a minute since I used Android, but I definitely felt the same when I switched to the iPhone. I found it a much more refined experience over all. That said, if there was a decent Linux phone, I’d hop on it, warts and all. Pinephone or Librem are getting close.
- deregulateMed 5y ago
  I wonder if you got a garbage Android. Samsung is the Apple of Android. Big marketing budget, medium quality.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
tsherr 5y ago
On my ancient and overloaded S8, the camera loads in under a second after double tapping power. Battery lasts all day (and it's 4 years old). Doesn't turn on when it's in my pocket. These anecdotal "I switched to x and its waaay better" things always reek of bias. That a 2017 phone is slower than a 2018 phone is obvious - plus you'd need to reset the s7 to factory defaults for fair(er) comparison. I do support on iPhones (not an Apple employee) and I've never experienced the the vaunted "this is so much better" moment.
- eldaisfish 5y ago
  your phone is the exception, not the norm. Apple are well known for choosing hardware that delivers a great user experience. Their choices may not cater to your specific requirements but their sales figures strongly indicate that the majority of people disagree with you. If you want to see how much value there is in Apple's phones, look at the used phone market. The competition isn't even close and iphones hold their value much better than the vast majority of android phones.
  - kevin_thibedeau 5y ago
    Android hardware isn't at fault. It's the bloated software stack written by Google devs only working on flagship phones.
  - falcrist 5y ago
    Are you sure its really the exception? I had an S6 that still functions really well with minimal battery degredation. I used it really heavily until I upgraded to an S9+, which is still going strong with pretty heavy use. I've used apple products too, but it sounds to me like the differences in quality are deeply exaggerated. I happen to like android mostly because I have access to the filesystem and like to tinker with settings (and I like using my headphone jack). As far as aftermarket value, I'm not convinced the used marked is completely rational... Or rather, there are plenty of confounding factors that make that a poor argument for which phone is built better.
    - eldaisfish 5y ago
      yes, your phone is the exception. There are numerically more exceptions because of the sheer number of android models out there but phones lasting longer than two or three years is the exception. You can see this on the estimated OS charts if you combine it with the knowledge that most android phones don't receive more than one OS update. I've had several android phones over the years and know several others who owned them as well. Both in developed and developing markets. Android phones are cheap and will suffer on two counts - software and hardware longevity. The used market may not be totally rational but there's a good case to be made for why apple devices tend to hold their value better - they are often built better. You cannot simply dismiss the higher price of used apple hardware as the market being irrational.
usrusr 5y ago
Apple has a camera button? (asking for an Xperia owner)
- taylodl 5y ago
  You can set it up in the Control Center. That's how I access my camera.
- eitland 5y ago
  Sorry, soft buttons. One on the lock screen and one in the home screen. And yes, as far as I remember Xperia was good, it just failed physically (later realized it was my fault as I used it as alarm clock and ended up applying force to the charging cable each morning.) Also they lost me as a customer when they included Amazon ads in a OS upgrade.
deregulateMed 5y ago
I went the other way. I got an iPhone in 2016 and was shocked at how poor the quality of hardware, os, and software was. Admittedly opening the box and giving Apple my personal information was fun. Maybe it was a bad time for Apple, but it was almost traumatic for me. They really did just use marketing to sell phones.
- onethought 5y ago
  Which iPhone was 2016 and what was the quality issue of the hardware, os and software? Consistently Apple have been the leaders in all of the above. Even now, superior chip, camera, battery life, pixel density... it's hard to find better. I've used Pixels since they became a thing and Apple iPhones. Other than quirky App Store bugs the quality issues almost always occur on the Pixel phones. ("Ok google" just stopping, gestures just stopping, ringing phone not responding to touch etc).
  - deregulateMed 5y ago
    Hardware might be related to software. The swiping from screen to screen was slow. I posted about this and people said to turn off animations. Annoyingly this was not straightforward and it didn't solve the problem. Not to mention having a unique charger meant an extra device to pack on trips. The os annoyance was the relentless "type in your apple id password", and multiple times per week updates. A few users have spun the narrative that updates are good, but these were annoying and didn't have any front facing benefits. No widgets really sucked, it was regressive not to have my next alarm time on my home screen. Finally Apple maps sucked, the podcast app was buggy, I'd hit play and nothing would happen. I'd then hit play a few times and nothing would happen. Then finally something would happen. I can't remember other software bugs, it's been years. Sure these might be fixed today, but I wonder what other things are bad today. I have ad blocking and a few other non play store apps on my phone, given the App Store, I'm not sure Apple would let such apps through.
WesleyHale 5y ago
The Note II was released in 2012, and the S7 was released in 2016. To be fair, transitioning from any phone around the S7 era to an iPhone XR bought in 2020 would probably give you the same feeling of revelation. The longest I've held on to a phone was the iPhone 7 Plus for ~4 years, but even after 2 and a 1/2 years it was starting to show it's age. By the time I got rid of it, a charge would last me a little over half a day from moderate use.

OJFord 5y ago

At least Apple actually makes stuff, so many companies really are just marketing companies, 'their products' being complete commodity items.