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I'm seeing a lot of "just raise wages" in this thread. The traditional GOP response on something like this is to get rid of the extended and special unemploymen

I'm seeing a lot of "just raise wages" in this thread. The traditional GOP response on something like this is to get rid of the extended and special unemployment insurance programs, and you'd see folks re-enter for minimum wage jobs. I'm not an expert in this field, but that naively seems like it would achieve the same result. Obviously there's a conversation to be had about fair wages, and whether a minimum wage is livable, but is there something else here that I'm missing about why that wouldn't also mitigate the current labor shortage?

m0llusk 5y ago
Extended unemployment has already been eliminated in many states and that had no effect. This might be an opportunity to review why these ideas about labor markets appear not to match what actually happens.
- jyrkesh 5y ago
  So then how are people paying to survive?
  - Splendor 5y ago
    Ending the extended unemployment benefits only reduces the weekly unemployment payment. In my state that was an extra $300/week. Our Governor got rid of that, but the labor shortage remains.
    - jyrkesh 5y ago
      But eventually the standard unemployment will run out too, right?
      - Splendor 5y ago
        Yes.
- bmarquez 5y ago
  I read an article[1] about workers suing states to restart extended unemployment (and are winning, at least in Maryland and Indiana so far). This would have an effect on the job market. [1] https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/markets/when-unemployment-ended-early-workers-sued-some-are-winning/ar-AALSuU2 https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/markets/when-unemployment-en...
droopyEyelids 5y ago
Your solution could definitely work, it's just less humane, so there are fewer people who naturally want to advocate for it. You might ask yourself why you want to stop at cutting unemployment benefits, when there are even more effective ways to coerce people into working.
- jyrkesh 5y ago
  Well...I personally wouldn't want to stop at unemployment benefits, but I'm not trying to make that case here because I understand there's a lot more moving pieces and it's much tougher case to make.
xmprt 5y ago
My answer is that for me (and I'm assuming a lot of people) it would just be too immoral to do that. It's like forcing people to work against their will.
Splendor 5y ago
> is there something else here that I'm missing about why that wouldn't also mitigate the current labor shortage - 600k+ dead people. - Increased hiring competition from more remote-friendly jobs. - Workers who don't want to return to employers who laid them off at the beginning of the pandemic or required them to work in unsafe conditions as "essential" workers.
- jyrkesh 5y ago
  First one is totally valid, and honestly a bit chilling. Not sure why that wasn't obvious to me. The 2nd one seems dubious to me: in my experience, people are moving to remote-friendly jobs from within the US...it doesn't explain why we have a shortage of people making pizza. The last one is the one I'm struggling with: I don't knock people at ALL for making those choices, but if they're struggling to survive and (as others have noted in response to me) unemployment insurance has ended, what are they doing instead of taking a job?
  - Splendor 5y ago
    Unemployment insurance hasn't necessarily ended. The extended benefits have in many case though. Those extended benefits included things like more money per week and benefits for longer. Regarding increased competition for people working from home, you're right. It might not be a huge factor, but I know two people who used to work in IRL service roles pre-covid who now work for call centers from their homes. So it is a possible factor even if it's a small one.
- sgerenser 5y ago
  The last one is definitely a factor, but #1 is hard to believe since the vast majority of the dead were well past retirement age. Similarly anyone in the running for a pizza tosser position is probably not also considering a remote software development job.
dvdhnt 5y ago
Well, it's not a "labor shortage" because, as others have explained, there is an ample supply of workers if an employer is willing to pay for them.

m0llusk 5y ago

Extended unemployment has already been eliminated in many states and that had no effect. This might be an opportunity to review why these ideas about labor markets appear not to match what actually happens.

jyrkesh 5y ago
So then how are people paying to survive?
- Splendor 5y ago
  Ending the extended unemployment benefits only reduces the weekly unemployment payment. In my state that was an extra $300/week. Our Governor got rid of that, but the labor shortage remains.
  - jyrkesh 5y ago
    But eventually the standard unemployment will run out too, right?
    - Splendor 5y ago
      Yes.
bmarquez 5y ago
I read an article[1] about workers suing states to restart extended unemployment (and are winning, at least in Maryland and Indiana so far). This would have an effect on the job market. [1] https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/markets/when-unemployment-ended-early-workers-sued-some-are-winning/ar-AALSuU2 https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/markets/when-unemployment-en...

droopyEyelids 5y ago

Your solution could definitely work, it's just less humane, so there are fewer people who naturally want to advocate for it. You might ask yourself why you want to stop at cutting unemployment benefits, when there are even more effective ways to coerce people into working.

jyrkesh 5y ago
Well...I personally wouldn't want to stop at unemployment benefits, but I'm not trying to make that case here because I understand there's a lot more moving pieces and it's much tougher case to make.

xmprt 5y ago

My answer is that for me (and I'm assuming a lot of people) it would just be too immoral to do that. It's like forcing people to work against their will.

Splendor 5y ago

> is there something else here that I'm missing about why that wouldn't also mitigate the current labor shortage - 600k+ dead people. - Increased hiring competition from more remote-friendly jobs. - Workers who don't want to return to employers who laid them off at the beginning of the pandemic or required them to work in unsafe conditions as "essential" workers.

jyrkesh 5y ago
First one is totally valid, and honestly a bit chilling. Not sure why that wasn't obvious to me. The 2nd one seems dubious to me: in my experience, people are moving to remote-friendly jobs from within the US...it doesn't explain why we have a shortage of people making pizza. The last one is the one I'm struggling with: I don't knock people at ALL for making those choices, but if they're struggling to survive and (as others have noted in response to me) unemployment insurance has ended, what are they doing instead of taking a job?
- Splendor 5y ago
  Unemployment insurance hasn't necessarily ended. The extended benefits have in many case though. Those extended benefits included things like more money per week and benefits for longer. Regarding increased competition for people working from home, you're right. It might not be a huge factor, but I know two people who used to work in IRL service roles pre-covid who now work for call centers from their homes. So it is a possible factor even if it's a small one.
sgerenser 5y ago
The last one is definitely a factor, but #1 is hard to believe since the vast majority of the dead were well past retirement age. Similarly anyone in the running for a pizza tosser position is probably not also considering a remote software development job.

dvdhnt 5y ago

Well, it's not a "labor shortage" because, as others have explained, there is an ample supply of workers if an employer is willing to pay for them.