3 ms·

I think downvotes are due to your claim that it's obvious that there's coordinated censorship. I don't think it is that obvious because, at least me personally

by chomp 5y ago

I think downvotes are due to your claim that it's obvious that there's coordinated censorship. I don't think it is that obvious because, at least me personally, I haven't seen any evidence of this. Now there are websites that are built around reducing visibility of unpopular opinions (like this one and Reddit), and elevating popular opinions (like Twitter), but I don't think it's fair to call this censorship. You can't join websites where opinions are judged and then complain when they're not judged your way. By that logic, every time a candidate loses office, they've been "censored", which isn't an honest application of that term. The only times I've seen posts stricken is when they're damaging in some way, like vaccine misinformation or voter misinformation. It just so happens that one side seems to indulge in a couple of those categories.

war1025 5y ago
> your claim that it's obvious that there's coordinated censorship. > I don't think it is that obvious because, at least me personally, I haven't seen any evidence of this. Not going to argue one way or another on this, but I do want to point out that you can change some words around and end up with: "I think the downvotes are due to your claim that it's obvious there is systemic racism. I don't think it's obvious because I haven't seen evidence of it. Black people just happen to commit more crimes"
- objectivetruth 5y ago
  There are plenty of sites where somebody saying "systemic racism obviously exists" would be downvoted or whatever those sites' equivalents are. If I went on a right-wing website to promote CRT, is their userbase downvoting me "censorship" as well?
- chomp 5y ago
  I think I see where you're comparing the two, (I think) your claim is that both systemic racism and mass censorship are two nuanced topics that aren't observable directly. Which is (maybe) true. Where your analogy falls apart is that I can observe systemic racism using impartial statistics. When controlling for variables, there is imbalance that cannot be explained by anything else. When we look at statistics for right-wing censorship on platforms, they find that this isn't happening[1][2][3][4][5] I can sympathize with an emotional argument that it feels like it's happening, but when I look at the facts, I can't see any evidence. I can't say that about systemic racism. I am willing to be convinced though. [1] https://bhr.stern.nyu.edu/bias-report-release-page https://bhr.stern.nyu.edu/bias-report-release-page [2] https://www.mediamatters.org/facebook/new-study-finds-facebook-not-censoring-conservatives-despite-their-repeated-attacks https://www.mediamatters.org/facebook/new-study-finds-facebo... [3] https://www.mediamatters.org/facebook/despite-bias-claims-facebook-not-censoring-conservatives https://www.mediamatters.org/facebook/despite-bias-claims-fa... [4] https://www.mediamatters.org/facebook/study-facebook-still-not-censoring-conservatives https://www.mediamatters.org/facebook/study-facebook-still-n... [5] https://www.mediamatters.org/facebook/study-right-wing-sources-dominate-abortion-related-news-facebook https://www.mediamatters.org/facebook/study-right-wing-sourc...

by chomp 5y ago

war1025 5y ago

> your claim that it's obvious that there's coordinated censorship. > I don't think it is that obvious because, at least me personally, I haven't seen any evidence of this. Not going to argue one way or another on this, but I do want to point out that you can change some words around and end up with: "I think the downvotes are due to your claim that it's obvious there is systemic racism. I don't think it's obvious because I haven't seen evidence of it. Black people just happen to commit more crimes"

objectivetruth 5y ago
There are plenty of sites where somebody saying "systemic racism obviously exists" would be downvoted or whatever those sites' equivalents are. If I went on a right-wing website to promote CRT, is their userbase downvoting me "censorship" as well?
chomp 5y ago
I think I see where you're comparing the two, (I think) your claim is that both systemic racism and mass censorship are two nuanced topics that aren't observable directly. Which is (maybe) true. Where your analogy falls apart is that I can observe systemic racism using impartial statistics. When controlling for variables, there is imbalance that cannot be explained by anything else. When we look at statistics for right-wing censorship on platforms, they find that this isn't happening[1][2][3][4][5] I can sympathize with an emotional argument that it feels like it's happening, but when I look at the facts, I can't see any evidence. I can't say that about systemic racism. I am willing to be convinced though. [1] https://bhr.stern.nyu.edu/bias-report-release-page https://bhr.stern.nyu.edu/bias-report-release-page [2] https://www.mediamatters.org/facebook/new-study-finds-facebook-not-censoring-conservatives-despite-their-repeated-attacks https://www.mediamatters.org/facebook/new-study-finds-facebo... [3] https://www.mediamatters.org/facebook/despite-bias-claims-facebook-not-censoring-conservatives https://www.mediamatters.org/facebook/despite-bias-claims-fa... [4] https://www.mediamatters.org/facebook/study-facebook-still-not-censoring-conservatives https://www.mediamatters.org/facebook/study-facebook-still-n... [5] https://www.mediamatters.org/facebook/study-right-wing-sources-dominate-abortion-related-news-facebook https://www.mediamatters.org/facebook/study-right-wing-sourc...