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Seeing the headline, I thought that can't be right; there are plenty of airport runways built on overpasses over major highways. The possibility of an at-grade

Seeing the headline, I thought that can't be right; there are plenty of airport runways built on overpasses over major highways. The possibility of an at-grade crossing between a public road and an international airport runway was not even in the realm of imagination for me!

miohtama 5y ago
It severely limits traffic, both air and land. There will be a tunnel for cars opening later this year. It is another kind of road rage sitting 45 minutes in a car in a queue when some dick decides to land with his private jet.
- PhantomGremlin 5y ago
  This doesn't seem like that much of a burden to endure. There are many many places in the USA where vehicular traffic must defer to rail traffic at level crossings. Which can easily occur more often than 30x per week (30 number is from the article). At some crossings it's not unusual to have a slow moving freight train take 15 minutes or more. How long is the road crossed for each plane? I'd expect 5 or 10 minutes max for a takeoff, I can understand they would want more time for a landing?
  - bavariancake 5y ago
    It's Europe, so the burden is the mere awareness that rich people exist who haven't been taxed into oblivion.
  - koyote 5y ago
    > This doesn't seem like that much of a burden to endure. The road in Gibraltar is a main thoroughfare and I believe the only way to get to the Spanish border. Imagine a rail crossing going through the 101 in SF.
    - mjmahone17 5y ago
      Considering Gibraltar has a grand total of 34,000 residents, it’s more similar to a rail crossing splitting Palo Alto. Which is the case. Similarly, probably as many people a day use the Fremont drawbridge in Seattle, which yields to boat traffic. I think this class of example is why people would be surprised so few cars would sometimes block air traffic. Also the 101 has traffic lights in SF, when the freeway turns into Van Ness. If Van Ness had a rail crossing, I’d expect cars to wait on trains.
      - Kiro 5y ago
        There's much more traffic than the residents. A lot of people work but doesn't live in Gibraltar, a lot of tourists and loads of people crossing the border just to buy cheap cigarettes. There are usually queues outside every cigarette shop. It's complete chaos at the border and nothing like any rail crossing I've ever seen.
        miohtama 5y ago
        Gibraltar has seen as many as 12M yearly tourists in its prepandemic peak https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tourism_in_Gibraltar https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tourism_in_Gibraltar For comparison, New York used to get 66M yearly tourists https://www.nytimes.com/2021/05/13/nyregion/nyc-tourism-covid.html https://www.nytimes.com/2021/05/13/nyregion/nyc-tourism-covi...
  - mark-r 5y ago
    A couple of weeks ago I had to stop at a train crossing, arrived just a few seconds late to beat the train. It was a very long train. Then I noticed it was slowing down. As it got within one car of passing the intersection it stopped completely. A guy jumped off and did some stuff, then jumped back on. And the train started moving again - in reverse! I wasn't timing how long I was stopped, but it seemed like forever.
- adamcstephens 5y ago
  Almost as bad as a different country claim stealing a portion of your country and claiming it as theirs?
  - miohtama 5y ago
    Like Ceuta?
    - saool 5y ago
      Not only is that a tu quoque fallacy but it also fails to take into account that both Ceuta and Melilla are integral parts of Spain and have been since the 16th century, centuries prior to Morocco's independence from France in 1956, whereas Gibraltar, being a British Overseas Territory, is not and never has been part of the United Kingdom.
      - deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
      - TMWNN 5y ago
        From Spain's perspective that's a distinction without a difference. If sometime in the past 300 years the British government had formally incorporated Gibraltar into the UK the way Hawaii is a part of the US or French Guiana is part of France, would Spain's complaints about British sovereignty over Gibraltar, and periodic attempts to regain the territory, be any less frequent? I think not.
        saool 5y ago
        As long as we are talking (de)colonization, the distinction makes all the difference. The difference in the treatment of a land and its people as equals to the rest of the country's citizens and states is what makes Hawaiians regular Americans and Ceuties regular Spaniards, and what keeps Llanitos from being British _citizens_. To answer your question: yeah, if Gibraltar was a self-sufficient state within the UK (instead of an -arguably- geo-strategic colony that is a tax haven according to the OECD) you likely wouldn't hear as many complaints about it. Take for example the cession of Sardinia in the very same Treaty of Utrecht. You ever hear complaints about its sovereignty?

miohtama 5y ago

It severely limits traffic, both air and land. There will be a tunnel for cars opening later this year. It is another kind of road rage sitting 45 minutes in a car in a queue when some dick decides to land with his private jet.

PhantomGremlin 5y ago
This doesn't seem like that much of a burden to endure. There are many many places in the USA where vehicular traffic must defer to rail traffic at level crossings. Which can easily occur more often than 30x per week (30 number is from the article). At some crossings it's not unusual to have a slow moving freight train take 15 minutes or more. How long is the road crossed for each plane? I'd expect 5 or 10 minutes max for a takeoff, I can understand they would want more time for a landing?
- bavariancake 5y ago
  It's Europe, so the burden is the mere awareness that rich people exist who haven't been taxed into oblivion.
- koyote 5y ago
  > This doesn't seem like that much of a burden to endure. The road in Gibraltar is a main thoroughfare and I believe the only way to get to the Spanish border. Imagine a rail crossing going through the 101 in SF.
  - mjmahone17 5y ago
    Considering Gibraltar has a grand total of 34,000 residents, it’s more similar to a rail crossing splitting Palo Alto. Which is the case. Similarly, probably as many people a day use the Fremont drawbridge in Seattle, which yields to boat traffic. I think this class of example is why people would be surprised so few cars would sometimes block air traffic. Also the 101 has traffic lights in SF, when the freeway turns into Van Ness. If Van Ness had a rail crossing, I’d expect cars to wait on trains.
    - Kiro 5y ago
      There's much more traffic than the residents. A lot of people work but doesn't live in Gibraltar, a lot of tourists and loads of people crossing the border just to buy cheap cigarettes. There are usually queues outside every cigarette shop. It's complete chaos at the border and nothing like any rail crossing I've ever seen.
      - miohtama 5y ago
        Gibraltar has seen as many as 12M yearly tourists in its prepandemic peak https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tourism_in_Gibraltar https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tourism_in_Gibraltar For comparison, New York used to get 66M yearly tourists https://www.nytimes.com/2021/05/13/nyregion/nyc-tourism-covid.html https://www.nytimes.com/2021/05/13/nyregion/nyc-tourism-covi...
- mark-r 5y ago
  A couple of weeks ago I had to stop at a train crossing, arrived just a few seconds late to beat the train. It was a very long train. Then I noticed it was slowing down. As it got within one car of passing the intersection it stopped completely. A guy jumped off and did some stuff, then jumped back on. And the train started moving again - in reverse! I wasn't timing how long I was stopped, but it seemed like forever.
adamcstephens 5y ago
Almost as bad as a different country claim stealing a portion of your country and claiming it as theirs?
- miohtama 5y ago
  Like Ceuta?
  - saool 5y ago
    Not only is that a tu quoque fallacy but it also fails to take into account that both Ceuta and Melilla are integral parts of Spain and have been since the 16th century, centuries prior to Morocco's independence from France in 1956, whereas Gibraltar, being a British Overseas Territory, is not and never has been part of the United Kingdom.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
    - TMWNN 5y ago
      From Spain's perspective that's a distinction without a difference. If sometime in the past 300 years the British government had formally incorporated Gibraltar into the UK the way Hawaii is a part of the US or French Guiana is part of France, would Spain's complaints about British sovereignty over Gibraltar, and periodic attempts to regain the territory, be any less frequent? I think not.
      - saool 5y ago
        As long as we are talking (de)colonization, the distinction makes all the difference. The difference in the treatment of a land and its people as equals to the rest of the country's citizens and states is what makes Hawaiians regular Americans and Ceuties regular Spaniards, and what keeps Llanitos from being British _citizens_. To answer your question: yeah, if Gibraltar was a self-sufficient state within the UK (instead of an -arguably- geo-strategic colony that is a tax haven according to the OECD) you likely wouldn't hear as many complaints about it. Take for example the cession of Sardinia in the very same Treaty of Utrecht. You ever hear complaints about its sovereignty?