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Not sure why you're getting down voted, that's how it works in Australia. Just look at how we're still embracing coal, and introducing mileage tax of EVs to re

Not sure why you're getting down voted, that's how it works in Australia. Just look at how we're still embracing coal, and introducing mileage tax of EVs to repel their takeup. There's a big network of old chummies and political donations from big fossil behind that.

brutusborn 5y ago
What's the mileage tax you mention?
- sundvor 5y ago
  It's a newly introduced km fee on all road usage for EVs only, not for ICEVs, in Victoria. https://www.caradvice.com.au/955801/victorias-ev-user-tax-is-a-lost-opportunity/#:~:text=In%20case%20you%20haven%27t,hit%20with%202.0c%2Fkm https://www.caradvice.com.au/955801/victorias-ev-user-tax-is.... https://www.whichcar.com.au/car-news/victoria-passes-ev-tax-effective-july-1-2021 https://www.whichcar.com.au/car-news/victoria-passes-ev-tax-... There's a $3k limited incentive that was used to distract from the fundamental issues behind taxing EV mileage. It doesn't cover long range cars as they're outside the price bracket. The reasoning was that there's no fuel excise being collected, yet the fuel tax isn't being used to cover roads - normal tax payments are. Also it doesn't care that ICEVs currently aren't paying for environmental emissions, when they should. Actually having said all that I should just have pasted https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fLflYkgnNBY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fLflYkgnNBY , which explains it all so much better. (Fair warning: Australian language).
  - chris_wot 5y ago
    Same thing is being proposed for NSW. Pathetic really.
    - dylan604 5y ago
      Why is it pathetic? As other commenters have stated, the fuel taxes have supposedly been about offsetting infrastructure costs of the roads and not a pollution control (at least in US). All cars need use of the roads whether EV or ICE powered. Personally, I'd rather they actually charged you by requiring odometer readings instead of a generic tax on utilitly fees. Maybe collect that info on your annual inspection vs the over the air telemetry??
      - ajmadesc 5y ago
        Here is a table of vehicle damage levels by size. https://streets.mn/2016/07/07/chart-of-the-day-vehicle-weight-vs-road-damage-levels/ https://streets.mn/2016/07/07/chart-of-the-day-vehicle-weigh...
        sundvor 5y ago
        "Fat man on freakishly heavy bicycle" => lol, thanks, I'm saving this for next time I hear "pay your reggo". (I _am_ paying on my ICEV, which I'm going to get carbon offsets for soon).
    - photojosh 5y ago
      The last I can find on the proposal for NSW to do the same is from April [0] yet in June they introduced EV purchases [1] with no mention of a mileage tax. I find it more than a tad ironic that the NSW Liberal (conservative) state government has the best EV incentives while the Victorian Labor ("progressive") has the worst, out of our two most populous states. [0] https://thedriven.io/2021/04/29/perrottet-flags-holistic-approach-to-electric-vehicle-road-tax-in-nsw/ https://thedriven.io/2021/04/29/perrottet-flags-holistic-app... [1] https://www.environment.nsw.gov.au/topics/climate-change/net-zero-plan/electric-vehicle-strategy https://www.environment.nsw.gov.au/topics/climate-change/net...
vanattab 5y ago
I support mileage taxes on Electric vehicles. The whole idea of the gas tax (at least in the US) was a way approximately tax road usage to fund infrastructure. Why should predominantly well off ev owners get out of paying for road maintenance? If we want to discourage carbon emissions just tax carbon.
- mullingitover 5y ago
  > Why should predominantly well off ev owners get out of paying for road maintenance? Great point. We should raise gas taxes to subsidize electric vehicles for people with low incomes. If enough people switch to electric to the point that this revenue starts seriously dropping, great: keep turning up the heat with more gasoline taxes until polluting vehicles are completely gone. The "it's not fair" trope about road maintenance for EVs isn't super compelling - the vast majority of road damage is from heavy vehicles like semis. Road damage increases with the cube of mass. Once we've put gasoline vehicles in the history books forever we can work on a mass*acceleration tax.
- sundvor 5y ago
  In Australia, roads are paid for by our taxes - not the fuel excise. I think I actually support a KM usage tax, but it'd have to be for all kinds of cars - not just the green kind. CO2/PM25 emissions tax should be on top of that. And: To buy an EV in Australia would be considerable stretch on my own budget, and I'd need every single dollar left after it. I'm actually needing a 2nd car now, and am loath to buy another ICEV.

brutusborn 5y ago

What's the mileage tax you mention?

sundvor 5y ago
It's a newly introduced km fee on all road usage for EVs only, not for ICEVs, in Victoria. https://www.caradvice.com.au/955801/victorias-ev-user-tax-is-a-lost-opportunity/#:~:text=In%20case%20you%20haven%27t,hit%20with%202.0c%2Fkm https://www.caradvice.com.au/955801/victorias-ev-user-tax-is.... https://www.whichcar.com.au/car-news/victoria-passes-ev-tax-effective-july-1-2021 https://www.whichcar.com.au/car-news/victoria-passes-ev-tax-... There's a $3k limited incentive that was used to distract from the fundamental issues behind taxing EV mileage. It doesn't cover long range cars as they're outside the price bracket. The reasoning was that there's no fuel excise being collected, yet the fuel tax isn't being used to cover roads - normal tax payments are. Also it doesn't care that ICEVs currently aren't paying for environmental emissions, when they should. Actually having said all that I should just have pasted https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fLflYkgnNBY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fLflYkgnNBY , which explains it all so much better. (Fair warning: Australian language).
- chris_wot 5y ago
  Same thing is being proposed for NSW. Pathetic really.
  - dylan604 5y ago
    Why is it pathetic? As other commenters have stated, the fuel taxes have supposedly been about offsetting infrastructure costs of the roads and not a pollution control (at least in US). All cars need use of the roads whether EV or ICE powered. Personally, I'd rather they actually charged you by requiring odometer readings instead of a generic tax on utilitly fees. Maybe collect that info on your annual inspection vs the over the air telemetry??
    - ajmadesc 5y ago
      Here is a table of vehicle damage levels by size. https://streets.mn/2016/07/07/chart-of-the-day-vehicle-weight-vs-road-damage-levels/ https://streets.mn/2016/07/07/chart-of-the-day-vehicle-weigh...
      - sundvor 5y ago
        "Fat man on freakishly heavy bicycle" => lol, thanks, I'm saving this for next time I hear "pay your reggo". (I _am_ paying on my ICEV, which I'm going to get carbon offsets for soon).
  - photojosh 5y ago
    The last I can find on the proposal for NSW to do the same is from April [0] yet in June they introduced EV purchases [1] with no mention of a mileage tax. I find it more than a tad ironic that the NSW Liberal (conservative) state government has the best EV incentives while the Victorian Labor ("progressive") has the worst, out of our two most populous states. [0] https://thedriven.io/2021/04/29/perrottet-flags-holistic-approach-to-electric-vehicle-road-tax-in-nsw/ https://thedriven.io/2021/04/29/perrottet-flags-holistic-app... [1] https://www.environment.nsw.gov.au/topics/climate-change/net-zero-plan/electric-vehicle-strategy https://www.environment.nsw.gov.au/topics/climate-change/net...

vanattab 5y ago

I support mileage taxes on Electric vehicles. The whole idea of the gas tax (at least in the US) was a way approximately tax road usage to fund infrastructure. Why should predominantly well off ev owners get out of paying for road maintenance? If we want to discourage carbon emissions just tax carbon.

mullingitover 5y ago
> Why should predominantly well off ev owners get out of paying for road maintenance? Great point. We should raise gas taxes to subsidize electric vehicles for people with low incomes. If enough people switch to electric to the point that this revenue starts seriously dropping, great: keep turning up the heat with more gasoline taxes until polluting vehicles are completely gone. The "it's not fair" trope about road maintenance for EVs isn't super compelling - the vast majority of road damage is from heavy vehicles like semis. Road damage increases with the cube of mass. Once we've put gasoline vehicles in the history books forever we can work on a mass*acceleration tax.
sundvor 5y ago
In Australia, roads are paid for by our taxes - not the fuel excise. I think I actually support a KM usage tax, but it'd have to be for all kinds of cars - not just the green kind. CO2/PM25 emissions tax should be on top of that. And: To buy an EV in Australia would be considerable stretch on my own budget, and I'd need every single dollar left after it. I'm actually needing a 2nd car now, and am loath to buy another ICEV.