3 ms·

The Netflix catalogue, and the movie rental/streaming ecosystem in general, was completely different when the AI challenge was going on. It was a DVD postal ser

The Netflix catalogue, and the movie rental/streaming ecosystem in general, was completely different when the AI challenge was going on. It was a DVD postal service. Your ratings mattered, and almost any movie you wanted was available. No one was bored scrolling Netflix trying to decide how to kill two hours before bed. They are clearly not using the ratings based automatic recommendations any more. It's not even relevant given the limited and generally low-quality content available. It's just about keeping enough people paying.

PaulHoule 5y ago
The current "Netflix Optimization Problem" is how to spend the minimum amount on content but still keep you subscribing. The Netflix prize also put Netflix on the map in terms of being a company that solves hard problems. We are still talking about it today and you'd better believe it has inspired talented people to work at Netflix; they could easily blow $1M on recruiting people and have much less to show for it. It's why Netflix is part of "FAANG". Reed Hastings genius is that he led Netflix through a number of transitions between fundamentally different businesses: he built a strong brand with the DVD-based business without permission from the studios, transferred that brand to streaming when the studios saw it as "free money". By the time the studios understood what it was worth Netflix decided it was cheaper to buy than rent. (just as a consequence of having more customers) The new frontier is that they use your engagement data not just to "suggest" the next movie but to design movies that will keep you engaged. It's a little bit scary with these services that are "all you can eat" games for $10 a month because you're giving up "voting with your dollar" but creating a trail of engagement that will be fed back into satisfying your narcissism. Taking screenshots and videos of games seems fun and harmless at first but somebody knows I had a big crush on Nikola and Chiara from Valkyria Chronicles 4.
- jareklupinski 5y ago
  > The new frontier is that they use your engagement data not just to "suggest" the next movie but to design movies that will keep you engaged. Personally, the opposite has been happening in my recommendations. I've been switching over to Netflix less and less as its library thins, and the replacements seem not as compelling... can't even remember the last time I watched a full movie or TV show season on Netflix. Guess I'm not the target demographic :( but it's not like I personally pay 'the Netflix bill' anyway. Toddlers seems to enjoy the procedurally generated content though; maybe they're mistaking toddlers randomly bashing their screen for audience engagement?
  - PaulHoule 5y ago
    "Appealing to narcissism" is dead easy on one level (avoids all sorts of problems that you could encounter with people otherwise), and very hard on another level. If you are always "present" and engaged then the target is going to do most of the work themselves. If "the lights are on and nobody is home" when you try to take a step forward, you really take 10 steps back.
dylan604 5y ago
>They are clearly not using the ratings based automatic recommendations any more. It's not even relevant given the limited and generally low-quality content available. It's just about keeping enough people paying. For those of us old enough to remember, it's not much different than going to Blockbuster. All of the new releases were along the walls with lots of copies to support the high demand. That's where everyone started when entering the store. If you found what you wanted, you grabbed a copy and left. In the middle of the store, the shelves were full of stuff you'd never heard of with one, maybe two, copies available. Both of those copies were covered in dust. You'd see people doing the physical version of endlessly scrolling to ultimately settle on "something" just to not be scrolling any more. Really, the only difference now is at least you don't have drive somewhere to do the scrolling. I'd also say that there's at least the advantage of being able to do it in your PJs, but Blockbuster (any video rental place really) was the first public place that I noticed it became acceptable to not have to get dressed to visit.
- jmilloy 5y ago
  The difference now is that, for 2 or 3 dollars, you can individually rent and stream most movies instantly. No need to pay a subscription that requires you to scroll through a small low-quality subset on a irritating interface.
  - sib 5y ago
    Speaking specifically of the US market (I don't know where you are), the list of available titles for transactional rental at any time is a tiny subset of all movies that exist on digital due to windowing (licensing) restrictions. By far, most movies are not available for rental.
    - jmilloy 5y ago
      That's fair. Maybe an order of magnitude difference between what's available on say Netflix streaming and what's available for individual rental, and maybe another order of magnitude for all movies? There sure are a lot of movies. I'm not sure where the Netflix DVD rental falls, especially if you account for movies that are technically available but with so few copies that it may take months to actually come to you.
gpayan 5y ago
> The Netflix catalogue, and the movie rental/streaming ecosystem in general, was completely different when the AI challenge was going on. With Netflix producing its own content now, and with the cost of acquiring content rights much higher than it used to be (all major streaming platforms want to offer great content), I'm wondering how much the business imperative impacts the recommendations we get -> eg. Netflix giving priority to its own content over licensed shows/movies.

PaulHoule 5y ago

The current "Netflix Optimization Problem" is how to spend the minimum amount on content but still keep you subscribing. The Netflix prize also put Netflix on the map in terms of being a company that solves hard problems. We are still talking about it today and you'd better believe it has inspired talented people to work at Netflix; they could easily blow $1M on recruiting people and have much less to show for it. It's why Netflix is part of "FAANG". Reed Hastings genius is that he led Netflix through a number of transitions between fundamentally different businesses: he built a strong brand with the DVD-based business without permission from the studios, transferred that brand to streaming when the studios saw it as "free money". By the time the studios understood what it was worth Netflix decided it was cheaper to buy than rent. (just as a consequence of having more customers) The new frontier is that they use your engagement data not just to "suggest" the next movie but to design movies that will keep you engaged. It's a little bit scary with these services that are "all you can eat" games for $10 a month because you're giving up "voting with your dollar" but creating a trail of engagement that will be fed back into satisfying your narcissism. Taking screenshots and videos of games seems fun and harmless at first but somebody knows I had a big crush on Nikola and Chiara from Valkyria Chronicles 4.

jareklupinski 5y ago
> The new frontier is that they use your engagement data not just to "suggest" the next movie but to design movies that will keep you engaged. Personally, the opposite has been happening in my recommendations. I've been switching over to Netflix less and less as its library thins, and the replacements seem not as compelling... can't even remember the last time I watched a full movie or TV show season on Netflix. Guess I'm not the target demographic :( but it's not like I personally pay 'the Netflix bill' anyway. Toddlers seems to enjoy the procedurally generated content though; maybe they're mistaking toddlers randomly bashing their screen for audience engagement?
- PaulHoule 5y ago
  "Appealing to narcissism" is dead easy on one level (avoids all sorts of problems that you could encounter with people otherwise), and very hard on another level. If you are always "present" and engaged then the target is going to do most of the work themselves. If "the lights are on and nobody is home" when you try to take a step forward, you really take 10 steps back.

dylan604 5y ago

>They are clearly not using the ratings based automatic recommendations any more. It's not even relevant given the limited and generally low-quality content available. It's just about keeping enough people paying. For those of us old enough to remember, it's not much different than going to Blockbuster. All of the new releases were along the walls with lots of copies to support the high demand. That's where everyone started when entering the store. If you found what you wanted, you grabbed a copy and left. In the middle of the store, the shelves were full of stuff you'd never heard of with one, maybe two, copies available. Both of those copies were covered in dust. You'd see people doing the physical version of endlessly scrolling to ultimately settle on "something" just to not be scrolling any more. Really, the only difference now is at least you don't have drive somewhere to do the scrolling. I'd also say that there's at least the advantage of being able to do it in your PJs, but Blockbuster (any video rental place really) was the first public place that I noticed it became acceptable to not have to get dressed to visit.

jmilloy 5y ago
The difference now is that, for 2 or 3 dollars, you can individually rent and stream most movies instantly. No need to pay a subscription that requires you to scroll through a small low-quality subset on a irritating interface.
- sib 5y ago
  Speaking specifically of the US market (I don't know where you are), the list of available titles for transactional rental at any time is a tiny subset of all movies that exist on digital due to windowing (licensing) restrictions. By far, most movies are not available for rental.
  - jmilloy 5y ago
    That's fair. Maybe an order of magnitude difference between what's available on say Netflix streaming and what's available for individual rental, and maybe another order of magnitude for all movies? There sure are a lot of movies. I'm not sure where the Netflix DVD rental falls, especially if you account for movies that are technically available but with so few copies that it may take months to actually come to you.

gpayan 5y ago

> The Netflix catalogue, and the movie rental/streaming ecosystem in general, was completely different when the AI challenge was going on. With Netflix producing its own content now, and with the cost of acquiring content rights much higher than it used to be (all major streaming platforms want to offer great content), I'm wondering how much the business imperative impacts the recommendations we get -> eg. Netflix giving priority to its own content over licensed shows/movies.