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> it is one of their specialities as an OS/platform after all. Apple's been losing ground with creative-types across all industries and areas since their post-

> it is one of their specialities as an OS/platform after all. Apple's been losing ground with creative-types across all industries and areas since their post-2000s peak: the major attitude-adjustment came with the reputational harm that came from the launch-and-downfall of the 2013 Mac Pro. As a wry zinger, I find it ironic that creative-types cannot express their creativity, and especially their individually by way of system customization - nor explore opportunities for out-of-the-box solutions to their computing problems due to Apple's uniform hardware design and their locking-down of the platform. Remember when people used to apply custom skins to MacOS? Secure defaults is fine - I actively encourage it - but Apple is increasingly treating their desktop/laptop computing platform as though they own the hardware that's legally yours. It's my laptop and I want to root my own OS, why won't they let me?

easton 5y ago
Are there things you still can't do after running "csrutil disable"? I'm honestly asking, because it seems like after doing that on my Mac I don't hit any weird errors when I try to say, modify the sudoers file or whatever.
spicybright 5y ago
Apples been doing that for yeaaars, especially with mobile devices (not that that's news to you) Anecdote: I had an iPad pro I put in a drawer for a while. I had it synced to an apple account from my old job (used my corporate email for it). When I took it out after I moved jobs, it became permanently locked with no recourse because I didn't have access to the email anymore. And there was no way to factrory reset it, so it became as useful as a coaster. Really pushed me away from mobile apple devices...
- EricE 5y ago
  Device lock is hardly something unique to Apple devices. It's unfortunate you forgot to unlock it before you lost access to that email account, but all may not be lost - have you tried account recovery? https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT204921 https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT204921 For anyone else reading this - take heed. It's better to ensure you can recover before you need to. Apple provides multiple ways to ensure you have access to an important Apple ID - with or without access to email. You can generate a recovery key that will work whether or not you have access to the email or phones associated with the Apple ID: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT208072 https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT208072 When you now create an Apple ID it nags the crap out of you to print and file it. If you created your Apple ID before they offered the recovery keys, now's a great time to go generate it and stash it away in a safe space! You can also set up backup/secondary emails and phone numbers in your Apple ID - not a bad idea either. It's easy to overlook this kind of stuff when setting up ID's, and not all vendors justify this kind of diligence when you create a new account. But with Apple because of device lock (which is a useful feature for theft deterrence or just petty revenge that a damn thief will get no benefit from my stolen stuff), any data or purchases you may have associated with that account it's well worth ensuring you will be able to recover your ID before you are in a situation where you need it :)
  - spicybright 5y ago
    This was around 2014, I wasn't aware of any of these recovery methods above. Even brought it to a genius bar and they said "tough luck". Trashed it shortly after because it was useless. I'm just very used to holding a paper clip in a hole for a minute and getting to use a device fresh, I guess!
  - oauea 5y ago
    Sorry, not interested in hardware that turns into a coaster if I don't follow it's very obscure setup instructions. Hardware factory reset or no thanks.
alwillis 5y ago
And yet Mac sales have never been better: https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2021/04/apple-reports-second-quarter-results/ https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2021/04/apple-reports-second-...
- swiley 5y ago
  Ye olde price=utility.
- andrekandre 5y ago
  yes, tbh there is no real incentive for apple to perticularly cater to a limited market like that, when there is more money to be made elsewhere
tomduncalf 5y ago
Among the music makers, programmers and designers that I know, the vast majority still use Macs despite the annoyance of the 2016-19 laptop fiasco etc. I know one or two who have switched to Windows because they needed high performance machines and weren’t willing to pay Mac Pro prices, and a couple who tried and ended up switching back because they found the Windows experience inferior. I don’t think I know anyone IRL who is worried about the Mac becoming locked down - iOS sure, but you can still basically do what you want on a Mac for most people. The reality is that for most people the Mac is a relatively hassle free experience. You don’t need to worry about whether it has certain components that will affect audio performance etc. - my understanding is you still need to be careful with chipset etc. on PCs.

easton 5y ago

Are there things you still can't do after running "csrutil disable"? I'm honestly asking, because it seems like after doing that on my Mac I don't hit any weird errors when I try to say, modify the sudoers file or whatever.

spicybright 5y ago

Apples been doing that for yeaaars, especially with mobile devices (not that that's news to you) Anecdote: I had an iPad pro I put in a drawer for a while. I had it synced to an apple account from my old job (used my corporate email for it). When I took it out after I moved jobs, it became permanently locked with no recourse because I didn't have access to the email anymore. And there was no way to factrory reset it, so it became as useful as a coaster. Really pushed me away from mobile apple devices...

EricE 5y ago
Device lock is hardly something unique to Apple devices. It's unfortunate you forgot to unlock it before you lost access to that email account, but all may not be lost - have you tried account recovery? https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT204921 https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT204921 For anyone else reading this - take heed. It's better to ensure you can recover before you need to. Apple provides multiple ways to ensure you have access to an important Apple ID - with or without access to email. You can generate a recovery key that will work whether or not you have access to the email or phones associated with the Apple ID: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT208072 https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT208072 When you now create an Apple ID it nags the crap out of you to print and file it. If you created your Apple ID before they offered the recovery keys, now's a great time to go generate it and stash it away in a safe space! You can also set up backup/secondary emails and phone numbers in your Apple ID - not a bad idea either. It's easy to overlook this kind of stuff when setting up ID's, and not all vendors justify this kind of diligence when you create a new account. But with Apple because of device lock (which is a useful feature for theft deterrence or just petty revenge that a damn thief will get no benefit from my stolen stuff), any data or purchases you may have associated with that account it's well worth ensuring you will be able to recover your ID before you are in a situation where you need it :)
- spicybright 5y ago
  This was around 2014, I wasn't aware of any of these recovery methods above. Even brought it to a genius bar and they said "tough luck". Trashed it shortly after because it was useless. I'm just very used to holding a paper clip in a hole for a minute and getting to use a device fresh, I guess!
- oauea 5y ago
  Sorry, not interested in hardware that turns into a coaster if I don't follow it's very obscure setup instructions. Hardware factory reset or no thanks.

alwillis 5y ago

And yet Mac sales have never been better: https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2021/04/apple-reports-second-quarter-results/ https://www.apple.com/newsroom/2021/04/apple-reports-second-...

swiley 5y ago
Ye olde price=utility.
andrekandre 5y ago
yes, tbh there is no real incentive for apple to perticularly cater to a limited market like that, when there is more money to be made elsewhere

tomduncalf 5y ago

Among the music makers, programmers and designers that I know, the vast majority still use Macs despite the annoyance of the 2016-19 laptop fiasco etc. I know one or two who have switched to Windows because they needed high performance machines and weren’t willing to pay Mac Pro prices, and a couple who tried and ended up switching back because they found the Windows experience inferior. I don’t think I know anyone IRL who is worried about the Mac becoming locked down - iOS sure, but you can still basically do what you want on a Mac for most people. The reality is that for most people the Mac is a relatively hassle free experience. You don’t need to worry about whether it has certain components that will affect audio performance etc. - my understanding is you still need to be careful with chipset etc. on PCs.