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Meditation isn't a "trance state". There are recurring refutations of this throughout Buddhist literature over the millenia. The answer to a conditioned existen

Meditation isn't a "trance state". There are recurring refutations of this throughout Buddhist literature over the millenia. The answer to a conditioned existence is not more conditioning. Yes, states of refined pleasure can be used as springboards for insight, so-called "jhanas" but they are by no means the dominant method of practice. Seeing through conditioned reality doesn't require any trance or altered state at all, just a lot of practice and time and patience. Qigong is its own thing and should be addressed as its own thing. It's an energy-based practice with various claims to longevity and health through proscribed movements.

hnzix 5y ago
> Qigong is its own thing Qigong exercises are very much like guided meditation, almost like kata in martial arts. You can gain the benefits of Qigong as meditation without buying into the energy work as anything other than a metaphor.
- sorokod 5y ago
  Better leave martial arts out of this. Kata is just a form, a pattern you repeat until the movments are known to the body. If you overload the kata with spiritual/psychological baggage, it isn't martial arts anymore. To quote a teacher, its "Ken before Zen" Disclosure: have been practicing for more then two decades.
- emptysongglass 5y ago
  From my early evaluations of it, insight practice is absent, a necessary prerequisite to detachment and direct experience of conditioned reality.
gabereiser 5y ago
Qigong is a form of meditation. I've been practicing it for over 20 years. I learned it from Shih Yan Ming of the USA Shaolin Temple. My term "trance state" is an anecdote to the words he used. "Emptiness of the mind". I'm simply stating my own experience here.
SyzygistSix 5y ago
Meditation is many things. One of those is a trance state, although I can see how that is not helpful to "beginners", when awareness and clearing the mind is generally more the point. But using meditation to achieve trance states has a long history. To the extent that it predates history.

hnzix 5y ago

> Qigong is its own thing Qigong exercises are very much like guided meditation, almost like kata in martial arts. You can gain the benefits of Qigong as meditation without buying into the energy work as anything other than a metaphor.

sorokod 5y ago
Better leave martial arts out of this. Kata is just a form, a pattern you repeat until the movments are known to the body. If you overload the kata with spiritual/psychological baggage, it isn't martial arts anymore. To quote a teacher, its "Ken before Zen" Disclosure: have been practicing for more then two decades.
emptysongglass 5y ago
From my early evaluations of it, insight practice is absent, a necessary prerequisite to detachment and direct experience of conditioned reality.

gabereiser 5y ago

Qigong is a form of meditation. I've been practicing it for over 20 years. I learned it from Shih Yan Ming of the USA Shaolin Temple. My term "trance state" is an anecdote to the words he used. "Emptiness of the mind". I'm simply stating my own experience here.

SyzygistSix 5y ago

Meditation is many things. One of those is a trance state, although I can see how that is not helpful to "beginners", when awareness and clearing the mind is generally more the point. But using meditation to achieve trance states has a long history. To the extent that it predates history.