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For context, these are China's current restrictions on gaming for minors (under age 18): - Maximum 1.5 hours of gaming on weekdays - Maximum 3 hours of gaming

For context, these are China's current restrictions on gaming for minors (under age 18): - Maximum 1.5 hours of gaming on weekdays - Maximum 3 hours of gaming on weekends - No games between 10pm and 8am (note that school typically starts between 7 and 8am) South Korea has similar types of restrictions, by the way. No gaming for minors (under 16) between midnight and 6am. I think Vietnam may have something similar as well.

chillwaves 5y ago
Not that I don't believe you, but Chinese teams compete at the highest levels of competitive gaming. There has to be some loopholes. Same goes for South Korea. Actually, China and South Korea are the two most dominant regions for many games.
- komaromy 5y ago
  Are there minors on the top-level Chinese teams?
  - dieortin 5y ago
    People who have played way less when they were minors would be at a big disadvantage compared to the rest of the world.
  - chillwaves 5y ago
    The average age is around 20 and I doubt they are training to the most competitive levels in just a year or two. > China's most famous e-sports player, Jian Zihao, has officially retired from gaming aged 23, citing ill-health. > He had been a professional gamer since 2012, playing League of Legends under the name of "Uzi". https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-52920786 https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-52920786 He would have been ~15 in 2012.
- rococode 5y ago
  China's restrictions are pretty new (implemented in 2019) so their long-term impact is yet to be seen. And Korea's law is much less restrictive since kids can play as much as they like before midnight.
- tstrimple 5y ago
  I don’t think China is particularly competitive in e-sports relative to places like S. Korea or the US. At least for the few I watched (mostly overwatch, counter strike) China always struggled at the bottom of the list.
  - Master_Odin 5y ago
    China is very competitive in the moba genre, like League of Legends and DOTA2.
  - JCharante 5y ago
    In the League scene the US (technically NA) region is at the bottom of the tier list.
josephcsible 5y ago
> South Korea has similar types of restrictions, by the way. No gaming for minors (under 16) between midnight and 6am. I'm disappointed but not surprised that China makes rules like this, but I always thought South Korea was basically a free country and never expected this sort of rule from them.
- industriousthou 5y ago
  So, generally, I really dislike this kind of paternalism. This rule in particular doesn't seem that crazy, but enforcement just seems completely unrealistic without major privacy violations. Maybe that's why I dislike this kind of paternalism.
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- Sr_developer 5y ago
  Like young people in America aged 16-21 who cannot buy alcohol legally in the US? That seems pretty totalitarian and paternalistic from outside the US
  - enjoylife 5y ago
    In a car centric environment such as the US, there is a large burden society pays for when it comes to under age drunk driving. The harm from a car related fatality is felt immediately. It’s hard to compare that to the delayed and difficult to measure societal impact when kids play too much video games.
    - danielheath 5y ago
      It's delayed, and difficult to measure precisely, but there's a substantial cohort of people who cannot and may never be able to support themselves due to the combination of gaming all night and cultural expectations around hiring. Perhaps it would be free-er for the government to intervene and force everyone to have a different cultural expectation, but both are very substantial interferences.
noduerme 5y ago
I had no idea such laws existed. That's pretty crazy. But then, this is a gov't that does not trust its citizens to raise their own children, or even historically to decide how many kids to have. When I was a kid in America, my parents disallowed videogames in the house. No NES or Genesis for us. On the occasions I'd go over to other kids' houses and play, I had no idea what I was doing. On the one hand, this seemed oppressive. But at least it was coming from my parents, not from the gov't. What we did have was a Mac II that I had pretty much free reign on, as long as I wasn't playing games. This is how I learned to code - trying to write my own games. In the long run, it made me a pretty bad gamer; I have the gaming equivalent of an eating disorder (I have serious guilt issues with playing anything for more than a couple hours). But it made me a pretty decent hacker. Obviously, it's disgusting for the gov't to do anything along these lines with facial recognition of minors who should be even more protected from surveillance than the adult public. Extremely Orwellian. But I'm interested what kind of unanticipated side effects it might have as far as kids learning to roll-their-own entertainment.
- SN76477 5y ago
  I never understand to what end. Is it simply power? What is the point of it? You cannot crime or human behavior to misbehave. I wonder how long it will be until China's citizens start to crack under the pressure.
  - HeavenFox 5y ago
    It is cultural. In Confucianism, the relationship between a father and a son, a superior and their subordinate, a state and its citizen are considered equal. Therefore it is considered normal for the state to be paternalistic. Also, collective responsibility takes precedence over individual freedom. Each person is supposed to conform to its role in society. Children’s role is to study, rather than play video games all night. Together, you get a video game ban, enforced by the full power of the state. Until a few years ago, video game consoles are banned in China for the exact same reason.
    - jbluepolarbear 5y ago
voidnullnil 5y ago
As usual good advice but shouldn't be law.
gentleman11 5y ago
The backdrop to this is how unbelievably predatory f2p East Asian games are when it comes to slot machine mechanics and whale hunting. Most adults in Japan, I read, think of video games as if they are the same as casino games. It wasn’t until 10 years ago that the west really got on that bandwagon, but now I think we’re leaders in this. Eg, blizzard switching f2p games with loot boxes so heavily, and aiming to make a new Diablo as a mobile game
- nchie 5y ago
  From what I've read, we're still very much beginners when it comes to this in the west.
- firestarter223 5y ago
  Nintendo is Japanese, and I don't think they heavily rely on such mechanics. They may have such aspects in their games for mobile phones, though.
  - kevingadd 5y ago
    Sadly their phone games imitate the worst things their competitors in both Japan and China are doing in terms of gambling, predatory pricing, etc. The revenue's certainly good.
    - firestarter223 5y ago
      True, as I said, nevertheless they seem to have a huge tradition and catalogue of non-predatory games.
dirtyid 5y ago
Also limits monthly microtransactions from $28 to $57 depending on age. Knowing Chinese chicken (helicopter) parents, these restrictions are overwhelmingly government listening to public opinion. Sucks for the kids, but really only affects always online products from domestic services. Infinite amount of offline DRM free options to still waste time on, much less gacha/gambly than what's being pushed these days. Kids grew up on gameboys and emulators fine - I know folks with strict parents that that gamed exclusively on a TI83. This is far from an effective ban on video games.
lasagnaphil 5y ago
There's a well-known open secret that every kid in South Korea have perfectly memorized either their mom or dad's citizen ID (the full 13 digits). There's also a statistic that the distribution of age in kid's popular online games is centered around the 40s/50s... you get the idea. Children usually borrow IDs/phones from your parents or other adult acquaintances (whether it be with or without permission.) Though PC-bangs (Internet cafes) are where you can't get away with this restriction - usually they check your IDs and kick all minors out when it becomes 10pm. What really sucks for kids in South Korea is that cram schools (hagwons) also end at 10pm (another national restriction) - which means that after a stressful day in hagwon they have no time to actually play without circumventing the rules...
_the_inflator 5y ago
Ok. Sounds like an unfair advantage for Western kids who want to be pro gamers to me then. More time to play, more time to train. ;)
antihero 5y ago
Man that fucking sucks. I spent far more time than that playing CS1.6 as a kid, I turned out fine. I would be absolutely livid if my government tried to tell me how much time I could spend doing what I wanted, and remember distinctly being conscious of making those decisions for myself from at least 12+ (lying a lot because of the amount of services that made me say I was over 13).
- sudosysgen 5y ago
  On the upside, kids are going to start playing CS 1.6 since it doesn't have this DRM instead of slot machine simulators. As a kid my school's DRM prevented more modern, online games so we played a cracked version to CS 1.6 over the local network, it was loads of fun.
JCharante 5y ago
> I think Vietnam may have something similar as well Vietnam may have these laws (I don't know), but they are not enforced in any way nor are there software steps to enforce it (ask for SSN, ask for proof of age)
karmasimida 5y ago
As Chinese, my first console is bought when I got my job. So it is true, Chinese parents, or Confucian inspired ones, see gaming as something more sinister than drugs.
blindmute 5y ago
It's a shame that China is so authoritarian, but at least they're controlling people positively in this aspect.

chillwaves 5y ago

Not that I don't believe you, but Chinese teams compete at the highest levels of competitive gaming. There has to be some loopholes. Same goes for South Korea. Actually, China and South Korea are the two most dominant regions for many games.

komaromy 5y ago
Are there minors on the top-level Chinese teams?
- dieortin 5y ago
  People who have played way less when they were minors would be at a big disadvantage compared to the rest of the world.
- chillwaves 5y ago
  The average age is around 20 and I doubt they are training to the most competitive levels in just a year or two. > China's most famous e-sports player, Jian Zihao, has officially retired from gaming aged 23, citing ill-health. > He had been a professional gamer since 2012, playing League of Legends under the name of "Uzi". https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-52920786 https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-52920786 He would have been ~15 in 2012.
rococode 5y ago
China's restrictions are pretty new (implemented in 2019) so their long-term impact is yet to be seen. And Korea's law is much less restrictive since kids can play as much as they like before midnight.
tstrimple 5y ago
I don’t think China is particularly competitive in e-sports relative to places like S. Korea or the US. At least for the few I watched (mostly overwatch, counter strike) China always struggled at the bottom of the list.
- Master_Odin 5y ago
  China is very competitive in the moba genre, like League of Legends and DOTA2.
- JCharante 5y ago
  In the League scene the US (technically NA) region is at the bottom of the tier list.

josephcsible 5y ago

> South Korea has similar types of restrictions, by the way. No gaming for minors (under 16) between midnight and 6am. I'm disappointed but not surprised that China makes rules like this, but I always thought South Korea was basically a free country and never expected this sort of rule from them.

industriousthou 5y ago
So, generally, I really dislike this kind of paternalism. This rule in particular doesn't seem that crazy, but enforcement just seems completely unrealistic without major privacy violations. Maybe that's why I dislike this kind of paternalism.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
Sr_developer 5y ago
Like young people in America aged 16-21 who cannot buy alcohol legally in the US? That seems pretty totalitarian and paternalistic from outside the US
- enjoylife 5y ago
  In a car centric environment such as the US, there is a large burden society pays for when it comes to under age drunk driving. The harm from a car related fatality is felt immediately. It’s hard to compare that to the delayed and difficult to measure societal impact when kids play too much video games.
  - danielheath 5y ago
    It's delayed, and difficult to measure precisely, but there's a substantial cohort of people who cannot and may never be able to support themselves due to the combination of gaming all night and cultural expectations around hiring. Perhaps it would be free-er for the government to intervene and force everyone to have a different cultural expectation, but both are very substantial interferences.

noduerme 5y ago

I had no idea such laws existed. That's pretty crazy. But then, this is a gov't that does not trust its citizens to raise their own children, or even historically to decide how many kids to have. When I was a kid in America, my parents disallowed videogames in the house. No NES or Genesis for us. On the occasions I'd go over to other kids' houses and play, I had no idea what I was doing. On the one hand, this seemed oppressive. But at least it was coming from my parents, not from the gov't. What we did have was a Mac II that I had pretty much free reign on, as long as I wasn't playing games. This is how I learned to code - trying to write my own games. In the long run, it made me a pretty bad gamer; I have the gaming equivalent of an eating disorder (I have serious guilt issues with playing anything for more than a couple hours). But it made me a pretty decent hacker. Obviously, it's disgusting for the gov't to do anything along these lines with facial recognition of minors who should be even more protected from surveillance than the adult public. Extremely Orwellian. But I'm interested what kind of unanticipated side effects it might have as far as kids learning to roll-their-own entertainment.

SN76477 5y ago
I never understand to what end. Is it simply power? What is the point of it? You cannot crime or human behavior to misbehave. I wonder how long it will be until China's citizens start to crack under the pressure.
- HeavenFox 5y ago
  It is cultural. In Confucianism, the relationship between a father and a son, a superior and their subordinate, a state and its citizen are considered equal. Therefore it is considered normal for the state to be paternalistic. Also, collective responsibility takes precedence over individual freedom. Each person is supposed to conform to its role in society. Children’s role is to study, rather than play video games all night. Together, you get a video game ban, enforced by the full power of the state. Until a few years ago, video game consoles are banned in China for the exact same reason.
  - jbluepolarbear 5y ago

voidnullnil 5y ago

As usual good advice but shouldn't be law.

gentleman11 5y ago

The backdrop to this is how unbelievably predatory f2p East Asian games are when it comes to slot machine mechanics and whale hunting. Most adults in Japan, I read, think of video games as if they are the same as casino games. It wasn’t until 10 years ago that the west really got on that bandwagon, but now I think we’re leaders in this. Eg, blizzard switching f2p games with loot boxes so heavily, and aiming to make a new Diablo as a mobile game

nchie 5y ago
From what I've read, we're still very much beginners when it comes to this in the west.
firestarter223 5y ago
Nintendo is Japanese, and I don't think they heavily rely on such mechanics. They may have such aspects in their games for mobile phones, though.
- kevingadd 5y ago
  Sadly their phone games imitate the worst things their competitors in both Japan and China are doing in terms of gambling, predatory pricing, etc. The revenue's certainly good.
  - firestarter223 5y ago
    True, as I said, nevertheless they seem to have a huge tradition and catalogue of non-predatory games.

dirtyid 5y ago

Also limits monthly microtransactions from $28 to $57 depending on age. Knowing Chinese chicken (helicopter) parents, these restrictions are overwhelmingly government listening to public opinion. Sucks for the kids, but really only affects always online products from domestic services. Infinite amount of offline DRM free options to still waste time on, much less gacha/gambly than what's being pushed these days. Kids grew up on gameboys and emulators fine - I know folks with strict parents that that gamed exclusively on a TI83. This is far from an effective ban on video games.

lasagnaphil 5y ago

There's a well-known open secret that every kid in South Korea have perfectly memorized either their mom or dad's citizen ID (the full 13 digits). There's also a statistic that the distribution of age in kid's popular online games is centered around the 40s/50s... you get the idea. Children usually borrow IDs/phones from your parents or other adult acquaintances (whether it be with or without permission.) Though PC-bangs (Internet cafes) are where you can't get away with this restriction - usually they check your IDs and kick all minors out when it becomes 10pm. What really sucks for kids in South Korea is that cram schools (hagwons) also end at 10pm (another national restriction) - which means that after a stressful day in hagwon they have no time to actually play without circumventing the rules...

_the_inflator 5y ago

Ok. Sounds like an unfair advantage for Western kids who want to be pro gamers to me then. More time to play, more time to train. ;)

antihero 5y ago

Man that fucking sucks. I spent far more time than that playing CS1.6 as a kid, I turned out fine. I would be absolutely livid if my government tried to tell me how much time I could spend doing what I wanted, and remember distinctly being conscious of making those decisions for myself from at least 12+ (lying a lot because of the amount of services that made me say I was over 13).

sudosysgen 5y ago
On the upside, kids are going to start playing CS 1.6 since it doesn't have this DRM instead of slot machine simulators. As a kid my school's DRM prevented more modern, online games so we played a cracked version to CS 1.6 over the local network, it was loads of fun.

JCharante 5y ago

> I think Vietnam may have something similar as well Vietnam may have these laws (I don't know), but they are not enforced in any way nor are there software steps to enforce it (ask for SSN, ask for proof of age)

karmasimida 5y ago

As Chinese, my first console is bought when I got my job. So it is true, Chinese parents, or Confucian inspired ones, see gaming as something more sinister than drugs.

blindmute 5y ago

It's a shame that China is so authoritarian, but at least they're controlling people positively in this aspect.