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"Cheating" is a meaningless concept once you reach college in my opinion. Either students are learning or they're not. They're (usually) paying money to be ther

"Cheating" is a meaningless concept once you reach college in my opinion. Either students are learning or they're not. They're (usually) paying money to be there and the only applicable metric is if the skills they acquire while chasing down the degree are worth the money they or their parents spend. To that end, I was impressed with the OP's thoughts on deterring this sort of behavior in the future. Because really, the only person suffering from this behavior is the student. By altering the coursework to make the motives for copying virtually meaningless the professor's goal is accomplished with a minimum amount of effort.

leot 15y ago
> "... the only person suffering from this behavior is the student." Actually, everyone suffers. Fellow students suffer, as some are compelled to cheat to compete because their peers do. Alumni suffer as students grades lose their value and the university is seen as less rigorous. Similarly for academia as a whole. Finally, society has to deal with whole cohorts that have been formally rewarded for making poor ethical choices.
sliverstorm 15y ago
the only person suffering from this behavior is the student You really think so? The more diplomas you give to students who learned nothing, the more the rest of the world will pick up on it and refuse to hire anyone from your University.
- michaelochurch 15y ago
  Also, the more unqualified people get through college, the less a college diploma means. I wouldn't say that cheating is the only reason for the problems with the college diploma in the U.S., but it's a substantial contributor. The 20% cheating rate observed by this professor is fairly normal across the entire country and a lot of unqualified students get through by cheating.
  - wisty 15y ago
    Also, the more unqualified people get through college, the less jobs there are for non-degree holders. Why would you hire a school leaver, when there's plenty of degree holders lining up for the job? So the diploma is worth more, for the students who just scrape by. Unless diplomas start to lose all credibility.
- gecko 15y ago
  I couldn't agree more. There are a few schools ("good" ones!) that we get a fair number of applicants from where I've learned to just ignore applicants' GPAs when evaluating them, because they're inflated to the point of being useless. The candidates might still get an interview, but it's now hinging entirely on the quality of their cover letter and whatever extracurricular things they've posted to GitHub/Google Code/Kiln/whatever. In other words, their godawful expensive Ivy League education is now literally worth less, to me, than some of the much smaller, cheaper tech colleges whose GPAs I've found are actually at least vaguely reflective of the students' abilities. People such as your parent post make my life easier, I guess: when in doubt, I can get lazy and throw the résumé in the trash. Otherwise, I think that it's way past time for universities to start caring about grade inflation, whether it comes from widespread cheating or from lazy professors.
jpitz 15y ago
Full disclosure: I am a college dropout - so take this with a grain of salt. At the very least, it matters, if only a little, to the reputation of the institution. If they start turning out plagiarizing idiots, eventually they become unable to charge as much for that education.
gojomo 15y ago
Others will suffer if the students continue the practice in their later accounting, legal testimony, health and safety practices, and business partnerships. Do you think after succeeding with cheating through college, they can turn it off like a switch when the stakes are higher?
dimitar 15y ago
Yes, the student is the only one suffering. Going to school and not learning anything is pointless and the diploma by itself is worthless in the long run. Unless it turns into a complete party place, the university will do just fine and employers don't really care what your grades are and how you got them.
JabavuAdams 15y ago
... until they get a job writing for an online info-database, and their idea of creating new content consists of copying wholesale competitor's pages.

leot 15y ago

> "... the only person suffering from this behavior is the student." Actually, everyone suffers. Fellow students suffer, as some are compelled to cheat to compete because their peers do. Alumni suffer as students grades lose their value and the university is seen as less rigorous. Similarly for academia as a whole. Finally, society has to deal with whole cohorts that have been formally rewarded for making poor ethical choices.

sliverstorm 15y ago

the only person suffering from this behavior is the student You really think so? The more diplomas you give to students who learned nothing, the more the rest of the world will pick up on it and refuse to hire anyone from your University.

michaelochurch 15y ago
Also, the more unqualified people get through college, the less a college diploma means. I wouldn't say that cheating is the only reason for the problems with the college diploma in the U.S., but it's a substantial contributor. The 20% cheating rate observed by this professor is fairly normal across the entire country and a lot of unqualified students get through by cheating.
- wisty 15y ago
  Also, the more unqualified people get through college, the less jobs there are for non-degree holders. Why would you hire a school leaver, when there's plenty of degree holders lining up for the job? So the diploma is worth more, for the students who just scrape by. Unless diplomas start to lose all credibility.
gecko 15y ago
I couldn't agree more. There are a few schools ("good" ones!) that we get a fair number of applicants from where I've learned to just ignore applicants' GPAs when evaluating them, because they're inflated to the point of being useless. The candidates might still get an interview, but it's now hinging entirely on the quality of their cover letter and whatever extracurricular things they've posted to GitHub/Google Code/Kiln/whatever. In other words, their godawful expensive Ivy League education is now literally worth less, to me, than some of the much smaller, cheaper tech colleges whose GPAs I've found are actually at least vaguely reflective of the students' abilities. People such as your parent post make my life easier, I guess: when in doubt, I can get lazy and throw the résumé in the trash. Otherwise, I think that it's way past time for universities to start caring about grade inflation, whether it comes from widespread cheating or from lazy professors.

jpitz 15y ago

Full disclosure: I am a college dropout - so take this with a grain of salt. At the very least, it matters, if only a little, to the reputation of the institution. If they start turning out plagiarizing idiots, eventually they become unable to charge as much for that education.

gojomo 15y ago

Others will suffer if the students continue the practice in their later accounting, legal testimony, health and safety practices, and business partnerships. Do you think after succeeding with cheating through college, they can turn it off like a switch when the stakes are higher?

dimitar 15y ago

Yes, the student is the only one suffering. Going to school and not learning anything is pointless and the diploma by itself is worthless in the long run. Unless it turns into a complete party place, the university will do just fine and employers don't really care what your grades are and how you got them.

JabavuAdams 15y ago

... until they get a job writing for an online info-database, and their idea of creating new content consists of copying wholesale competitor's pages.