5 ms·

Is there any connection with Crimean Goths? [1,2] It doesn't make sense that people will migrate from England to Crimea just out of the blue. It's only make s

Is there any connection with Crimean Goths? [1,2] It doesn't make sense that people will migrate from England to Crimea just out of the blue. It's only make sense if they were already in the Mediterranean region and then were looking to settle in either colder climate, free rich lands, or a combination of the above. There are also older anti-Normanist theories that Kievan Rus was founded by the people/warriors from the South (i.e. Crimea or adjacent Sea of Azov area). [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crimean_Goths https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crimean_Goths [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crimean_Gothic https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crimean_Gothic [3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Normanism https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Normanism

djbebs 5y ago
By this time a significant pprtion of the varangian guard were actually anglo saxon.
- throwaway2048 5y ago
  for all the fanfare the vikings get, the anglo-saxons were nearly as infamous as raiders and pirates, although usually in a slightly earlier era. Consider how they came to conquer and settle England.
  - bivargen 5y ago
    And on a tangent to a tangent: The Old norse word for ‘boat’ is usually ‘bátr’, not the expected inherited ‘beitr’. The former is a loanword from Anglo-saxon and the inherited ’beitr’ is only found in poetry. While anecdotal, it is interesting that a culture so associated with seafaring as the viking-age Scandinavia borrowed the word for boat.
  - herewulf 5y ago
    Yes, indeed. Consider also the fact that the Anglo-Saxons were culturally and ethnically similar to the Vikings (whom the Anglo-Saxons collectively referred to as "Danes" despite also coming from Norway and Sweden). The Danelaw[1] had resulted in significant intermixing of Anglo-Saxons and Danes, and by 1066 England had had two Danish kings. It's completely unsurprising that Anglo-Saxons integrated well into the Varangian Guard. [1]: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danelaw https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danelaw
Nicholas_C 5y ago
> It doesn't make sense that people will migrate from England to Crimea just out of the blue. The article states that they didn’t want to be ruled by the Normans so they left and wandered around the Mediterranean then went to Constantinople to help with a siege. Then they were told they could settle an area that wasn’t currently under the Byzantine Empire’s control, which was in Crimea.
- kitd 5y ago
  The novel "The Last English King" by Julian Rathbone [1] centers on one of Harold's housecarls who, after the defeat at Hastings, travels widely over Europe and the Near East before returning to Norman England. Interesting to see there may be some historical fact behind it. 1 - https://www.amazon.co.uk/Last-English-King-Julian-Rathbone/dp/0349109435 https://www.amazon.co.uk/Last-English-King-Julian-Rathbone/d...
cmrdporcupine 5y ago
It does make one wonder if some of the later attestations of Crimean Gothic language survival in the area might actually be people mistaking spoken Anglo-Saxon as Gothic.

djbebs 5y ago

By this time a significant pprtion of the varangian guard were actually anglo saxon.

throwaway2048 5y ago
for all the fanfare the vikings get, the anglo-saxons were nearly as infamous as raiders and pirates, although usually in a slightly earlier era. Consider how they came to conquer and settle England.
- bivargen 5y ago
  And on a tangent to a tangent: The Old norse word for ‘boat’ is usually ‘bátr’, not the expected inherited ‘beitr’. The former is a loanword from Anglo-saxon and the inherited ’beitr’ is only found in poetry. While anecdotal, it is interesting that a culture so associated with seafaring as the viking-age Scandinavia borrowed the word for boat.
- herewulf 5y ago
  Yes, indeed. Consider also the fact that the Anglo-Saxons were culturally and ethnically similar to the Vikings (whom the Anglo-Saxons collectively referred to as "Danes" despite also coming from Norway and Sweden). The Danelaw[1] had resulted in significant intermixing of Anglo-Saxons and Danes, and by 1066 England had had two Danish kings. It's completely unsurprising that Anglo-Saxons integrated well into the Varangian Guard. [1]: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danelaw https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danelaw

Nicholas_C 5y ago

> It doesn't make sense that people will migrate from England to Crimea just out of the blue. The article states that they didn’t want to be ruled by the Normans so they left and wandered around the Mediterranean then went to Constantinople to help with a siege. Then they were told they could settle an area that wasn’t currently under the Byzantine Empire’s control, which was in Crimea.

kitd 5y ago
The novel "The Last English King" by Julian Rathbone [1] centers on one of Harold's housecarls who, after the defeat at Hastings, travels widely over Europe and the Near East before returning to Norman England. Interesting to see there may be some historical fact behind it. 1 - https://www.amazon.co.uk/Last-English-King-Julian-Rathbone/dp/0349109435 https://www.amazon.co.uk/Last-English-King-Julian-Rathbone/d...

cmrdporcupine 5y ago

It does make one wonder if some of the later attestations of Crimean Gothic language survival in the area might actually be people mistaking spoken Anglo-Saxon as Gothic.