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I tried salvia divinorum a few times, and the biggest insight I got from it was that the human brain is a machine, and is designed to do a specific thing, but i

I tried salvia divinorum a few times, and the biggest insight I got from it was that the human brain is a machine, and is designed to do a specific thing, but if you throw a bunch of chemicals into it you can convert it into a machine for doing other random things like generate visual garbage and noise. I felt like my working memory had been reduced to only persisting for a half second, and my thoughts were reflected back onto themselves, making me get stuck in a moment in time and making it impossible to hold onto a train of thought, and my visual field was looped back on itself like when you point a camera at its own screen. I didn’t find the experience pleasurable, really.

palimpsests 5y ago
did you consume this via smoking or sublingual administration? your experience sounds like that which can happen when salvia divinorum is smoked. the traditional method of consumption by the Mazatec people (who have used this plant medicine in ritual for thousands of years) is sublingual. creates an incredibly different effect than smoking it. tends to be much more pleasant and easier to integrate. I do know several folks who quite enjoy smoking it. They are in the minority, however.
- filoeleven 5y ago
  From what I’ve read, the dissociative effects are much greater from smoking it than from the sublingual route. A minority of people enjoy dissociative effects, so your report makes sense. I’m curious about what makes certain people enjoy dissociatives, since most people find them very uncomfortable.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - palimpsests 5y ago
    It's all about the dose! Sublingual can be just as dissociative - perhaps even more - than smoking. Sublingual can give a much longer experience, and so there's a lot more time spent in that space (30-45+ minutes compared to 5-10). What makes you say that most people find dissociatives uncomfortable? Consider ketamine - a powerful dissociative that has widespread recreational use. When used in a therapeutic, safe setting, the dissociative properties of medicines like salvia, ketamine, iboga, and 5-MeO-DMT are used to facilitate profound personal healing and transformation. These experiences are not necessarily pleasant, and that's also not the point. I'm most familiar with usage in this context, where the aspect of "enjoyment" is essentially orthogonal to the reason for consumption. In fact, consciously exploring any discomfort that arises is what can facilitate efficacy.
    - filoeleven 5y ago
      > What makes you say that most people find dissociatives uncomfortable? Anecdotal evidence from people who have tried them, as well as reading lots of experience reports. It’s hard to discern from all of that who/how many were taking them therapeutically vs recreationally. Your grain of salt is quite justified.
- fallingfrog 5y ago
  Smoked. Never tried it sublingually.

palimpsests 5y ago

did you consume this via smoking or sublingual administration? your experience sounds like that which can happen when salvia divinorum is smoked. the traditional method of consumption by the Mazatec people (who have used this plant medicine in ritual for thousands of years) is sublingual. creates an incredibly different effect than smoking it. tends to be much more pleasant and easier to integrate. I do know several folks who quite enjoy smoking it. They are in the minority, however.

filoeleven 5y ago
From what I’ve read, the dissociative effects are much greater from smoking it than from the sublingual route. A minority of people enjoy dissociative effects, so your report makes sense. I’m curious about what makes certain people enjoy dissociatives, since most people find them very uncomfortable.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- palimpsests 5y ago
  It's all about the dose! Sublingual can be just as dissociative - perhaps even more - than smoking. Sublingual can give a much longer experience, and so there's a lot more time spent in that space (30-45+ minutes compared to 5-10). What makes you say that most people find dissociatives uncomfortable? Consider ketamine - a powerful dissociative that has widespread recreational use. When used in a therapeutic, safe setting, the dissociative properties of medicines like salvia, ketamine, iboga, and 5-MeO-DMT are used to facilitate profound personal healing and transformation. These experiences are not necessarily pleasant, and that's also not the point. I'm most familiar with usage in this context, where the aspect of "enjoyment" is essentially orthogonal to the reason for consumption. In fact, consciously exploring any discomfort that arises is what can facilitate efficacy.
  - filoeleven 5y ago
    > What makes you say that most people find dissociatives uncomfortable? Anecdotal evidence from people who have tried them, as well as reading lots of experience reports. It’s hard to discern from all of that who/how many were taking them therapeutically vs recreationally. Your grain of salt is quite justified.
fallingfrog 5y ago
Smoked. Never tried it sublingually.