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> Being a Windows or macOS user macOS is nowhere near as bad as Windows. You can still use it without an Apple account, and there are no ads/spyware (unless yo

> Being a Windows or macOS user macOS is nowhere near as bad as Windows. You can still use it without an Apple account, and there are no ads/spyware (unless you really want to pick straws) even if you do use an Apple account.

sneak 5y ago
That's not true. Apple devices maintain 24/7 persistent connections back to Apple with client certificates based on the unchangeable hardware serial number. Apple knows (or can know) the approximate location of every modern Apple device. It's better than Windows, but it's still spyware.
- BiteCode_dev 5y ago
  Also it has a mesh network of devices (see airtag), which makes it even more intrusive: you can be offline, but if you use your BT headphones, they can get to you. They say they protect your privacy but I never forget they were part of PRISM, so their words are worth nothing.
- okamiueru 5y ago
  That's not the worst part. MacOS monitors every time you run an executable, which executable, when and where, and it shares this with unencrypted traffic. Not only that, but the data is collected as part of PRISM, so there is no court order to get it. https://sneak.berlin/20201112/your-computer-isnt-yours/ https://sneak.berlin/20201112/your-computer-isnt-yours/
  - sneak 5y ago
    It's not "collected as part of PRISM" any more than any other thing is. PRISM is an internal codename for (not bulk! specific!) downloading of data direct from FAANG et al servers under FISA Amendments Act section 702. It's warrantless but is not bulk/mass surveillance. (Also, it technically is a "court order" as there is a secret rubber stamp "FISA court", but it doesn't require a warrant or probable cause, or allow for review/appeal because it's proceedings are classified.) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Foreign_Intelligence_Surveillance_Court https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Foreign_Intell... Theoretically it's not supposed to be used against US citizens but Snowden has claimed that a secret interpretation in a secret court has decided that it can be. https://www.eff.org/702-spying https://www.eff.org/702-spying They use it a ton, though, as it's the #1 most used source in the US IC. Apple turns over more than 30k user accounts of data under warrantless FISA orders each year, per their own transparency report. That said, Apple has (in response to my blog post you linked) committed to a) encrypting that OCSP traffic in the next macOS, and b) deleting all of their stored logs. That wouldn't have stopped the IC from monitoring all of that previous unencrypted traffic and logging it themselves, though, but that has nothing to do with PRISM/FISA. That's bulk collection, which is a different thing than PRISM.
- sneak 5y ago
  Oh, it's also worth mentioning that even if you don't use the App Store, iCloud, or an Apple ID, you cannot opt out or disable these push connections. You have to filter them at the network level if you don't want a mac, iPhone, or iPad to phone home.

sneak 5y ago

That's not true. Apple devices maintain 24/7 persistent connections back to Apple with client certificates based on the unchangeable hardware serial number. Apple knows (or can know) the approximate location of every modern Apple device. It's better than Windows, but it's still spyware.

BiteCode_dev 5y ago
Also it has a mesh network of devices (see airtag), which makes it even more intrusive: you can be offline, but if you use your BT headphones, they can get to you. They say they protect your privacy but I never forget they were part of PRISM, so their words are worth nothing.
okamiueru 5y ago
That's not the worst part. MacOS monitors every time you run an executable, which executable, when and where, and it shares this with unencrypted traffic. Not only that, but the data is collected as part of PRISM, so there is no court order to get it. https://sneak.berlin/20201112/your-computer-isnt-yours/ https://sneak.berlin/20201112/your-computer-isnt-yours/
- sneak 5y ago
  It's not "collected as part of PRISM" any more than any other thing is. PRISM is an internal codename for (not bulk! specific!) downloading of data direct from FAANG et al servers under FISA Amendments Act section 702. It's warrantless but is not bulk/mass surveillance. (Also, it technically is a "court order" as there is a secret rubber stamp "FISA court", but it doesn't require a warrant or probable cause, or allow for review/appeal because it's proceedings are classified.) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Foreign_Intelligence_Surveillance_Court https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Foreign_Intell... Theoretically it's not supposed to be used against US citizens but Snowden has claimed that a secret interpretation in a secret court has decided that it can be. https://www.eff.org/702-spying https://www.eff.org/702-spying They use it a ton, though, as it's the #1 most used source in the US IC. Apple turns over more than 30k user accounts of data under warrantless FISA orders each year, per their own transparency report. That said, Apple has (in response to my blog post you linked) committed to a) encrypting that OCSP traffic in the next macOS, and b) deleting all of their stored logs. That wouldn't have stopped the IC from monitoring all of that previous unencrypted traffic and logging it themselves, though, but that has nothing to do with PRISM/FISA. That's bulk collection, which is a different thing than PRISM.
sneak 5y ago
Oh, it's also worth mentioning that even if you don't use the App Store, iCloud, or an Apple ID, you cannot opt out or disable these push connections. You have to filter them at the network level if you don't want a mac, iPhone, or iPad to phone home.