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If you are trying to avoid spook you're fucked anywhere you are: US EU whatever. Yes, if the NSA want your US email they probably won't press that button, but t

If you are trying to avoid spook you're fucked anywhere you are: US EU whatever. Yes, if the NSA want your US email they probably won't press that button, but they'll ask GCHQ to press a UK button insetad and get it that way. Also, if the FBI wants your email they will just send a guy in a black MiB suit & 9/10 times the email company will roll over. If they meet resistance FBI just go to a tame US judge (they have loads) who rubber stamps the writ. If your server is in .CH they need lots of paperwork and a good arguable case. So yes it is worth hosting outside US. Ask Microsoft about why they do EU data hosting in Ireland.

mox1 5y ago
Your kinda proving parents point. To get email content outside the USA, there are no rules. NSA can do more or less what they want to obtain that data (hack,bribe,etc.) within the US, it requires some type of judicial process. You can argue about corrupt judges, power tripping FBI agents, etc. etc. but the fact is, its harder to obtain this data inside the USA. Further, if you are just committing regular old crimes, the FBI will need to run some type of parallel reconstruction IF they obtained your data using less than pristine methods. What DoJ attorney would risk their career cause some dumb-ass FBI agent went rogue and pistol whipped the sys-admin for the data?!?!?!?!
- tptacek 5y ago
  I'm not even trying to say you're meaningfully protected by US jurisdiction. I personally think you are, but I won't try to win the argument, and I think reasonable people can certainly disagree. I'm just saying that, if nothing else, selecting a smaller provider with fewer security resources just to get outside of the US is not a win with respect to mass surveillance.
- ikerdanzel 5y ago
  If you read finish, he basically proved to host it outside USA or any 5eyes. Hacking is way more difficult than pushing a button. This is why FBI insist a backdoor key for phone manufacturers.
  - tptacek 5y ago
    If we're not on the same page about why it's harder to crack the encrypted filesystem of a locked recent-model iPhone than it is to hack into an always-on database-backed SMTP email service, there's little point in us debating this further.

mox1 5y ago

Your kinda proving parents point. To get email content outside the USA, there are no rules. NSA can do more or less what they want to obtain that data (hack,bribe,etc.) within the US, it requires some type of judicial process. You can argue about corrupt judges, power tripping FBI agents, etc. etc. but the fact is, its harder to obtain this data inside the USA. Further, if you are just committing regular old crimes, the FBI will need to run some type of parallel reconstruction IF they obtained your data using less than pristine methods. What DoJ attorney would risk their career cause some dumb-ass FBI agent went rogue and pistol whipped the sys-admin for the data?!?!?!?!

tptacek 5y ago
I'm not even trying to say you're meaningfully protected by US jurisdiction. I personally think you are, but I won't try to win the argument, and I think reasonable people can certainly disagree. I'm just saying that, if nothing else, selecting a smaller provider with fewer security resources just to get outside of the US is not a win with respect to mass surveillance.
ikerdanzel 5y ago
If you read finish, he basically proved to host it outside USA or any 5eyes. Hacking is way more difficult than pushing a button. This is why FBI insist a backdoor key for phone manufacturers.
- tptacek 5y ago
  If we're not on the same page about why it's harder to crack the encrypted filesystem of a locked recent-model iPhone than it is to hack into an always-on database-backed SMTP email service, there's little point in us debating this further.