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To me it looks like Amazon is running these businesses without the risk or accountability that comes from that. It’s just another shell game to evade regulation

To me it looks like Amazon is running these businesses without the risk or accountability that comes from that. It’s just another shell game to evade regulation akin to Microsoft’s permanent contractors or gig economy workers

AmVess 5y ago
That's essentially it. They outsource the loss of delivering packages and make the company pay for it on top of it. I remember when this program came out and it was an exceedingly bad deal on the surface. I was surprised to see anyone buy into it.
- tablespoon 5y ago
  > I remember when this program came out and it was an exceedingly bad deal on the surface. I was surprised to see anyone buy into it. I have no actual firsthand knowledge about this program, but I wonder if part of it was an appeal to (for lack of a better term) some people's ignorant individualist optimism (e.g. the idea that other people will fail because they're slackers, but they can succeed because they're smarter, can work harder, etc.).
cartoonworld 5y ago
I was thinking about this more. If Amazon would shift from "Own your own business by running our delivery service for us!" to "Contract with amazon and provide fleet management services to our dynamic orthogonal growth paradigm with geometric returns!" this could be much more fairly and safely organized. Amazon could do whatever corporation thing they have to do to spin up a new business unit (to avoid this is probably why they are doing it in this honestly scam-ey way...but hey) and take on the payroll, benefits, training, compliance and overall insurance risk. Then, they can organize these "Logistics Companies" into something that looks more like a property management firm. 1) They need to create a national fleet account to charge and manage the vehicles services 2) They need to run the payroll and sign the check for their driver employees and warehouse logistics people 3) Create a property management agreement and designate a sort of foreman for the warehouse distribution operations. The existing Amazon delivery partners are well positioned to do this. 4) Make clear the relationship and own the vehicles. If they do not want to own the vehicles, they can make the "Logistics Companies" be like an Enterprise or Hertz self-branded fleet company. 5) Engage in a dispatch and planning program, and surely delegate this role from Amazon to the local logistics outfit. This will afford a lot of flexibility and take the burden off of Amazon of managing the dynamic local environments that they clearly don't want to touch. The fact that they don't do this leads me to believe that they really just want a bag man to take the blame when some old lady take an Amazon smile to the side of her walker and splatters on the pavement. Sorry for the grim ending. I really, really worry that the captain of the ship is some kind of overheating GPU in us-west.amazon.com or something worse, like an Iridium-connected Alexa skill in the ceiling fan of the ship head on "The Flying Fox".

AmVess 5y ago

That's essentially it. They outsource the loss of delivering packages and make the company pay for it on top of it. I remember when this program came out and it was an exceedingly bad deal on the surface. I was surprised to see anyone buy into it.

tablespoon 5y ago
> I remember when this program came out and it was an exceedingly bad deal on the surface. I was surprised to see anyone buy into it. I have no actual firsthand knowledge about this program, but I wonder if part of it was an appeal to (for lack of a better term) some people's ignorant individualist optimism (e.g. the idea that other people will fail because they're slackers, but they can succeed because they're smarter, can work harder, etc.).

cartoonworld 5y ago

I was thinking about this more. If Amazon would shift from "Own your own business by running our delivery service for us!" to "Contract with amazon and provide fleet management services to our dynamic orthogonal growth paradigm with geometric returns!" this could be much more fairly and safely organized. Amazon could do whatever corporation thing they have to do to spin up a new business unit (to avoid this is probably why they are doing it in this honestly scam-ey way...but hey) and take on the payroll, benefits, training, compliance and overall insurance risk. Then, they can organize these "Logistics Companies" into something that looks more like a property management firm. 1) They need to create a national fleet account to charge and manage the vehicles services 2) They need to run the payroll and sign the check for their driver employees and warehouse logistics people 3) Create a property management agreement and designate a sort of foreman for the warehouse distribution operations. The existing Amazon delivery partners are well positioned to do this. 4) Make clear the relationship and own the vehicles. If they do not want to own the vehicles, they can make the "Logistics Companies" be like an Enterprise or Hertz self-branded fleet company. 5) Engage in a dispatch and planning program, and surely delegate this role from Amazon to the local logistics outfit. This will afford a lot of flexibility and take the burden off of Amazon of managing the dynamic local environments that they clearly don't want to touch. The fact that they don't do this leads me to believe that they really just want a bag man to take the blame when some old lady take an Amazon smile to the side of her walker and splatters on the pavement. Sorry for the grim ending. I really, really worry that the captain of the ship is some kind of overheating GPU in us-west.amazon.com or something worse, like an Iridium-connected Alexa skill in the ceiling fan of the ship head on "The Flying Fox".