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> I'm not sure you have to keep pointing to the boogie man of soviet infiltrators to explain power hungry bureaucrats. Those have existed in literally every soc

> I'm not sure you have to keep pointing to the boogie man of soviet infiltrators to explain power hungry bureaucrats. Those have existed in literally every society since at least the early bronze age. No, I'd say power hunger is one thing, but what you face now is unique to this poisonous "Soviet Culture." A very special, aggressive brand of social nihilism at the apex of civil society, characteristic of one party/social class governments. Putin put his own spin on the timeless demoralisation tactic (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bX3EZCVj2XA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bX3EZCVj2XA ,) an even more aggressive targeting of both the new elites, and the establishment (see Biden Jr. adventures with in Ukraine.) Or plainly speaking playing both sides.

monocasa 5y ago
Putin's tactics are postmodern, a philosophy that at it's core (despite right wing propaganda around the terms) is intrinsically anti Marxist. Seeing the ghosts of soviets in every dark corner is something that these very elites we're talking about use to control you and your perceptions of reality.
- baybal2 5y ago
  > Putin's tactics are postmodern, a philosophy that at it's core (despite right wing propaganda around the terms) is intrinsically anti Marxist. This is what they want the West to believe. They want you to lower your guard, they want you to start working with them, and put thoughts like "hey, maybe those guys are a lesser evil than communists" into your head. They rely on people who they call "useful idiots" (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Useful_idiot https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Useful_idiot) in communist lingo to perpetuate, and spread such ideas to the West.
  - monocasa 5y ago
    > This is what they want the West to believe. They want you to lower your guard, they want you to start working with them, and put thoughts like "hey, maybe those guys are a lesser evil than communists" into your head. They're doing a terrible job then. They've somehow created an even worse society for Russians as far as I can tell. > They rely on people who they call "useful idiots" (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Useful_idiot https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Useful_idiot) in communist lingo to perpetuate, and spread such ideas to the West. You realize that your citation of Useful Idiot literally points out that there's no record of the term actually being used by the soviets, but instead appears to have been first used by the New York Times?
- evv555 5y ago
  >Putin's tactics are postmodern, a philosophy that at it's core (despite right wing propaganda around the terms) is intrinsically anti Marxist. That's not true. Postmodernism and Frankfurt School of Marxism are synonymous in todays culture. However I agree that late stage postmodernism is almost indistinguishable from Real Politik. End result is the same if your worldview reduces everything to power plays between collectives.
  - monocasa 5y ago
    Postmodernism was a reaction to movements like Frankfurt School which is pretty much peak Modern. You can see that in how pretty much the only consistent part of postmodernism is rejecting cognitive structures and abstractions for interpreting society like the example you gave of "reduc[ing] everything to power plays between collectives."
    - evv555 5y ago
      A reaction that builds upon and encapsulates Marxist meta-narratives. Yes in theory postmodernism can point to a diverse set of perspectives but in practice it's homogenous groupthink within a Marxist meta-narrative. End result is people operating in worldviews consisting of moral relativism and variations of "Marxist struggles". It's a worldview that has conflict intrinsic to it.
      - monocasa 5y ago
        Postmodernism is literally founded on the idea of rejecting meta-narratives. Lyotard in fact defines postmodernism as "incredulity to meta-narratives".
        evv555 5y ago
        Exactly... Postmodernism isn't a logically consistent worldview, almost by definition. It's full of performative contradictions in practice. Hence the need for "safe spaces". It doesn't stand up to logical discourse when its application is confronted.
dandersh 5y ago
"No, I'd say power hunger is one thing, but what you face now is unique to this poisonous "Soviet Culture." A very special, aggressive brand of social nihilism at the apex of civil society, characteristic of one party/social class governments" What you're describing is late stage capitalism. ""Did we aggressively fight against some of the science? Yes," Keith McCoy, the Exxon (XOM) lobbyist, said during a covertly filmed job interview recorded by Greenpeace's UK investigative platform. "Did we join some shadow groups to work against some of the early efforts? Yes, that's true," McCoy said in the video, which was published Wednesday by the UK's Channel 4. "But there's nothing illegal about that. We were looking out for our investments. we were looking out for our shareholders." https://www.cnn.com/2021/07/01/business/exxon-tape-video-keith-mccoy/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2021/07/01/business/exxon-tape-video-kei... The reframing of a company's purpose to "generate shareholder's wealth" is a relatively recent development (1970's) that came on the heels of right wing economic ideas gaining widespread adoption in American universities (Chicago School, etc). This is one of the reasons companies use to justify destruction of society and the planet in the pursuit of more, wealth, power, status, etc. There is nothing "Soviet Culture" about this or myriad other examples such as the tobacco industry or pharmaceutical companies and the opioid epidemic.
- baybal2 5y ago
  > There is nothing "Soviet Culture" about this or myriad other examples such as the tobacco industry or pharmaceutical companies and the opioid epidemic. Exactly this is a very good example of it being Randist, and Soviet. They believed in extreme social darwinism, in kratocracy, in moral legitimacy of their economic parasitism to feed off "weak bourgeois, civil society idiots, and lumpen-proletarian serfs" I other words, you have to feed fat communist bastards because of their self-proclaimed "class superiority."

monocasa 5y ago

Putin's tactics are postmodern, a philosophy that at it's core (despite right wing propaganda around the terms) is intrinsically anti Marxist. Seeing the ghosts of soviets in every dark corner is something that these very elites we're talking about use to control you and your perceptions of reality.

baybal2 5y ago
> Putin's tactics are postmodern, a philosophy that at it's core (despite right wing propaganda around the terms) is intrinsically anti Marxist. This is what they want the West to believe. They want you to lower your guard, they want you to start working with them, and put thoughts like "hey, maybe those guys are a lesser evil than communists" into your head. They rely on people who they call "useful idiots" (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Useful_idiot https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Useful_idiot) in communist lingo to perpetuate, and spread such ideas to the West.
- monocasa 5y ago
  > This is what they want the West to believe. They want you to lower your guard, they want you to start working with them, and put thoughts like "hey, maybe those guys are a lesser evil than communists" into your head. They're doing a terrible job then. They've somehow created an even worse society for Russians as far as I can tell. > They rely on people who they call "useful idiots" (https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Useful_idiot https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Useful_idiot) in communist lingo to perpetuate, and spread such ideas to the West. You realize that your citation of Useful Idiot literally points out that there's no record of the term actually being used by the soviets, but instead appears to have been first used by the New York Times?
evv555 5y ago
>Putin's tactics are postmodern, a philosophy that at it's core (despite right wing propaganda around the terms) is intrinsically anti Marxist. That's not true. Postmodernism and Frankfurt School of Marxism are synonymous in todays culture. However I agree that late stage postmodernism is almost indistinguishable from Real Politik. End result is the same if your worldview reduces everything to power plays between collectives.
- monocasa 5y ago
  Postmodernism was a reaction to movements like Frankfurt School which is pretty much peak Modern. You can see that in how pretty much the only consistent part of postmodernism is rejecting cognitive structures and abstractions for interpreting society like the example you gave of "reduc[ing] everything to power plays between collectives."
  - evv555 5y ago
    A reaction that builds upon and encapsulates Marxist meta-narratives. Yes in theory postmodernism can point to a diverse set of perspectives but in practice it's homogenous groupthink within a Marxist meta-narrative. End result is people operating in worldviews consisting of moral relativism and variations of "Marxist struggles". It's a worldview that has conflict intrinsic to it.
    - monocasa 5y ago
      Postmodernism is literally founded on the idea of rejecting meta-narratives. Lyotard in fact defines postmodernism as "incredulity to meta-narratives".
      - evv555 5y ago
        Exactly... Postmodernism isn't a logically consistent worldview, almost by definition. It's full of performative contradictions in practice. Hence the need for "safe spaces". It doesn't stand up to logical discourse when its application is confronted.

dandersh 5y ago

"No, I'd say power hunger is one thing, but what you face now is unique to this poisonous "Soviet Culture." A very special, aggressive brand of social nihilism at the apex of civil society, characteristic of one party/social class governments" What you're describing is late stage capitalism. ""Did we aggressively fight against some of the science? Yes," Keith McCoy, the Exxon (XOM) lobbyist, said during a covertly filmed job interview recorded by Greenpeace's UK investigative platform. "Did we join some shadow groups to work against some of the early efforts? Yes, that's true," McCoy said in the video, which was published Wednesday by the UK's Channel 4. "But there's nothing illegal about that. We were looking out for our investments. we were looking out for our shareholders." https://www.cnn.com/2021/07/01/business/exxon-tape-video-keith-mccoy/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2021/07/01/business/exxon-tape-video-kei... The reframing of a company's purpose to "generate shareholder's wealth" is a relatively recent development (1970's) that came on the heels of right wing economic ideas gaining widespread adoption in American universities (Chicago School, etc). This is one of the reasons companies use to justify destruction of society and the planet in the pursuit of more, wealth, power, status, etc. There is nothing "Soviet Culture" about this or myriad other examples such as the tobacco industry or pharmaceutical companies and the opioid epidemic.

baybal2 5y ago
> There is nothing "Soviet Culture" about this or myriad other examples such as the tobacco industry or pharmaceutical companies and the opioid epidemic. Exactly this is a very good example of it being Randist, and Soviet. They believed in extreme social darwinism, in kratocracy, in moral legitimacy of their economic parasitism to feed off "weak bourgeois, civil society idiots, and lumpen-proletarian serfs" I other words, you have to feed fat communist bastards because of their self-proclaimed "class superiority."