5 ms·

Society's past acceptance or ignorance of crimes does not absolve the gross polluters of responsibility for current and future crimes.

fallingknife 5y ago
You mean the gross polluters like us who willingly buy and burn the oil companies products every day, right?
- KozmoNau7 5y ago
  What's the alternative, what choice do we have, realistically? I ride my bicycle or walk for as many trips as possible, and take public transit. I don't own a car, instead I rent one when I absolutely have to. I buy/use as little single-use plastic as possible, I compost and sort whatever trash I do end up with. I've significantly reduced my meat intake and buy in-season groceries as much as possible. I buy second-hand whenever possible and keep things running for as long as possible. I repair everything I can, and only replace things whens they are irreparably broken. My desktop and laptop are both ~10 years old and still going strong. I live in a small apartment, I don't have AC, and I put on a hoodie rather than turning up the heat in winter. I use water-saving taps and shower heads, I use the shorter wash cycles on my washing machine and I line-dry all my clothes. The list goes on and on, you get the point. I try quite hard to reduce my own footprint. Sure, I could move to an off-grid cabin in the woods, but I'm not sure my footprint would actually be smaller from doing that. There is only so much consumers can do, when our entire economy is built upon the exploitation of natural resources and an almost complete disregard for negative externalities. Doing the best you realistically can as an individual is good and fine, but what we really need is harsh regulation of industry heavyweights, in order to force them to do better, as they have clearly proven to have no such motivation by themselves.
  - fallingknife 5y ago
    That's not my point. Mt point is that society was built the way it is to meet consumer demand. This is not something that was forced on us.
    - KozmoNau7 5y ago
      Consumer demand ceased to be primarily based on natural demand a long time ago. Pervasive marketing and advertising have successfully manufactured demand, by manipulation and creating a consumer fear of missing out on the latest and greatest shiny gadget. Breaking out of that pattern is borderline impossible. All because corporations only care about profit. Research into environmental impacts has been held back (and still is!) by corporate interests, because it's "bad for business" if consumers are too well informed. How can you make informed choices, when the information is censored and held back? Plus, "vote with your wallet" only works on a small scale. Regulation of gross polluters is what's actually needed to make real change.
pc86 5y ago
If you're going to throw around rhetoric like that you better have a negative carbon footprint.
- gonzo41 5y ago
  Well the are at least guilty of a moral crime from the point they knew. And that point was a while ago.
  - dimitrios1 5y ago
    If only issues fit so neatly into a well defined, black or white moral framework that everyone agrees with, life would be so much easier.
- KozmoNau7 5y ago
  I will accept my less than a millionth of a percent of guilt, if all the fossil fuel companies fully accept their enormous guilt past, present and future, and actually do something to end their pollution and destruction of the environment.
gotostatement 5y ago
the responses to this comment are the guy in the comic responding to "we should improve society somewhat" with "yet you participate in society. curious"

fallingknife 5y ago

You mean the gross polluters like us who willingly buy and burn the oil companies products every day, right?

KozmoNau7 5y ago
What's the alternative, what choice do we have, realistically? I ride my bicycle or walk for as many trips as possible, and take public transit. I don't own a car, instead I rent one when I absolutely have to. I buy/use as little single-use plastic as possible, I compost and sort whatever trash I do end up with. I've significantly reduced my meat intake and buy in-season groceries as much as possible. I buy second-hand whenever possible and keep things running for as long as possible. I repair everything I can, and only replace things whens they are irreparably broken. My desktop and laptop are both ~10 years old and still going strong. I live in a small apartment, I don't have AC, and I put on a hoodie rather than turning up the heat in winter. I use water-saving taps and shower heads, I use the shorter wash cycles on my washing machine and I line-dry all my clothes. The list goes on and on, you get the point. I try quite hard to reduce my own footprint. Sure, I could move to an off-grid cabin in the woods, but I'm not sure my footprint would actually be smaller from doing that. There is only so much consumers can do, when our entire economy is built upon the exploitation of natural resources and an almost complete disregard for negative externalities. Doing the best you realistically can as an individual is good and fine, but what we really need is harsh regulation of industry heavyweights, in order to force them to do better, as they have clearly proven to have no such motivation by themselves.
- fallingknife 5y ago
  That's not my point. Mt point is that society was built the way it is to meet consumer demand. This is not something that was forced on us.
  - KozmoNau7 5y ago
    Consumer demand ceased to be primarily based on natural demand a long time ago. Pervasive marketing and advertising have successfully manufactured demand, by manipulation and creating a consumer fear of missing out on the latest and greatest shiny gadget. Breaking out of that pattern is borderline impossible. All because corporations only care about profit. Research into environmental impacts has been held back (and still is!) by corporate interests, because it's "bad for business" if consumers are too well informed. How can you make informed choices, when the information is censored and held back? Plus, "vote with your wallet" only works on a small scale. Regulation of gross polluters is what's actually needed to make real change.

pc86 5y ago

If you're going to throw around rhetoric like that you better have a negative carbon footprint.

gonzo41 5y ago
Well the are at least guilty of a moral crime from the point they knew. And that point was a while ago.
- dimitrios1 5y ago
  If only issues fit so neatly into a well defined, black or white moral framework that everyone agrees with, life would be so much easier.
KozmoNau7 5y ago
I will accept my less than a millionth of a percent of guilt, if all the fossil fuel companies fully accept their enormous guilt past, present and future, and actually do something to end their pollution and destruction of the environment.

gotostatement 5y ago

the responses to this comment are the guy in the comic responding to "we should improve society somewhat" with "yet you participate in society. curious"