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Or just use mask/obfuscate the audio, and face while your at it. In some ways, the whole debate could be more civil if officers faces and voices were blurred.

by jopsen 5y ago

Or just use mask/obfuscate the audio, and face while your at it. In some ways, the whole debate could be more civil if officers faces and voices were blurred. After all, it's not really the individual officer who is at fault: it's the system that trained the officer, and the department policies that require officers to apply unreasonable force. There are also many other contributing factors to policing issues in the US. But the argument that it's just "a few bad apples" seems like deflection to me. And if it's not just a few bad apples, then why do we need to publicly shame individual officers who are just doing their job as they were trained to do, in line with department policies? (Doesn't such public shaming just create opposition and resentment, distracting from the issue at hand) Just saying... in other countries media don't go around posting/shaming people publicly if there is no conviction. (Sure, there is a balance, a few exceptions, and lots of nuance)

kemonocode 5y ago
> In some ways, the whole debate could be more civil if officers faces and voices were blurred. Police have no expectation of privacy when performing their official duties, at least in the US, so that should be a non-issue. If they don't want to bring consequences unto themselves for what they're doing, then perhaps they should stop doing such things or think really hard about their chosen career path. > After all, it's not really the individual officer who is at fault: it's the system that trained the officer, and the department policies that require officers to apply unreasonable force. At some point you can't just blame "the system" and there needs to be individual accountability. Mayhaps if they like the lack of it and with less bodily risk, they could pursue politics instead.
- jopsen 5y ago
  > Police have no expectation of privacy when performing their official duties... True, but that doesn't necessarily mean that we have to escalate to the point of publicly shaming officers. Or at-least maybe we don't always need to, sometimes it's definitely called for. > At some point you can't just blame "the system" and there needs to be individual accountability. I don't think any actions by any individual police officer is likely to scale far.
29083011397778 5y ago
> the argument that it's just "a few bad apples" seems like deflection to me That "defense" never really uses the full saying, does it? "A few bad apples spoil the barrel" is the full phrase. Without removing the few bad apples, what happens to the remaining apples in the barrel? That's why we need to bring these "few bad apples" to the forefront. If they're left alone, or treated as part of the group, they'll either spoil the rest of the department, or the entire department will take the heat for just a few of their coworkers abusing their power. Holding all officers accountable for the actions of few seems in poor form to me, though I have no data to back this up. To me though, it feels like we'll end up polarizing the LEOs that just want to do good work, much like how "Not all men" began.
- jopsen 5y ago
  > That's why we need to bring these "few bad apples" to the forefront. But can you un-spoil all the other apples of the barrel, by only removing the bad ones? I think not... once police stands idle by their bad apple co-workers, they are spoiled. I don't think you can unspoil the culture by just removing a few individual apples. Culture is hard to change.

by jopsen 5y ago

kemonocode 5y ago

> In some ways, the whole debate could be more civil if officers faces and voices were blurred. Police have no expectation of privacy when performing their official duties, at least in the US, so that should be a non-issue. If they don't want to bring consequences unto themselves for what they're doing, then perhaps they should stop doing such things or think really hard about their chosen career path. > After all, it's not really the individual officer who is at fault: it's the system that trained the officer, and the department policies that require officers to apply unreasonable force. At some point you can't just blame "the system" and there needs to be individual accountability. Mayhaps if they like the lack of it and with less bodily risk, they could pursue politics instead.

jopsen 5y ago
> Police have no expectation of privacy when performing their official duties... True, but that doesn't necessarily mean that we have to escalate to the point of publicly shaming officers. Or at-least maybe we don't always need to, sometimes it's definitely called for. > At some point you can't just blame "the system" and there needs to be individual accountability. I don't think any actions by any individual police officer is likely to scale far.

29083011397778 5y ago

> the argument that it's just "a few bad apples" seems like deflection to me That "defense" never really uses the full saying, does it? "A few bad apples spoil the barrel" is the full phrase. Without removing the few bad apples, what happens to the remaining apples in the barrel? That's why we need to bring these "few bad apples" to the forefront. If they're left alone, or treated as part of the group, they'll either spoil the rest of the department, or the entire department will take the heat for just a few of their coworkers abusing their power. Holding all officers accountable for the actions of few seems in poor form to me, though I have no data to back this up. To me though, it feels like we'll end up polarizing the LEOs that just want to do good work, much like how "Not all men" began.

jopsen 5y ago
> That's why we need to bring these "few bad apples" to the forefront. But can you un-spoil all the other apples of the barrel, by only removing the bad ones? I think not... once police stands idle by their bad apple co-workers, they are spoiled. I don't think you can unspoil the culture by just removing a few individual apples. Culture is hard to change.