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>Already said in this thread, but I think it's ridiculous that when people think about abusive big tech, they never think about Intuit. Because it isn't that b

>Already said in this thread, but I think it's ridiculous that when people think about abusive big tech, they never think about Intuit. Because it isn't that big of a deal. > Their business is literally the idea of creating friction in federal and local tax systems so they can extort people in exchange of removing some of those synthetic frictions (emphasis on "some"). That's a hyperbolic characterization. It's not that big of deal. Lobbying is a fact of life in a democracy. There are always interest groups on every side of any issue that lobby for their selfish benefit, frequently to the detriment of the public (e.g. public sector union contracts). That tends to make most government programs less efficient and more expensive then they could be because politicians will balance needs of all kinds of interest groups. That will never change. Intuit has a right to lobby for their interests. Characterizing this as somehow nefarious, or even as an outlier is hyperbolic. Welcome to Democracy.

trhway 5y ago
Marlon Brando look alikes have the right to lobby too. It doesn't make them any less evil.
- macspoofing 5y ago
  We are talking about inexpensive tax software as an alternative to free filing methods. It's not a big deal. Of course it could be more efficient and cheaper ... but so can many government programs. Are public sector unions evil when they negotiate outrageous contracts that the public has to pick up the tab for? This is what democracy looks like.
  - Miraste 5y ago
    This very article explains how they're deliberately blocking millions of desperately impoverished people from receiving billions of dollars. How is that not a big deal?
    - macspoofing 5y ago
      >they're deliberately blocking millions of desperately impoverished people from receiving billions of dollars. They aren't. Those programs don't require Intuit to claim.
      - Falling3 5y ago
        The problem isn't that Intuit wants to charge something instead or nothing. The filing fee is not the harmful part. The problem is they can't directly ensure people use their service. But they can indirectly make it hard to file without using their service by lobbying against tax code simplications that would benefit most fillers. Your argument makes it sound like you do not know what the issue in question actually is.
      - Miraste 5y ago
        Recipients' other options are hire a CPA (obviously untenable), find the correct forms, calculate the credit themselves, do the rest of their returns by hand, and submit those (difficult for the target groups) or... pay to use TurboTax. That's the exact dilemma this new site would've helped solve if it hadn't been sabotaged.
        macspoofing 5y ago
        > (difficult for the target groups) Why? My father is an immigrant, speaks with broken English and has no higher education ... and did his taxes for years with forms. Which target group are you referring to?
        Miraste 5y ago
        I'm referring to people with incomes low enough to qualify for the CTC. About half of US adults are functionally illiterate and innumerate, even measured by the Department of Education's (low) standards, and this correlates highly with income. I'm happy your father was able to do his own taxes, but he's not representative.
  - trhway 5y ago
    > Are public sector unions evil when they negotiate outrageous contracts that the public has to pick up the tab for? the question starts to sound more interesting when you add the fact that the members of that union have "death or life" power over the public. >This is what democracy looks like. it is more like a "contract you can't refuse".
Retric 5y ago
It’s fine to lobby for a group say fisherman or “the rich.” However, when you’re getting special laws written to hand your company money at the expense of everyone else in the country that’s corruption not lobbying.
Retric 5y ago
Bribery isn’t lobbying.
- macspoofing 5y ago
  Lobbying is lobbying. There is a tendency by some purist to label democratic actions like lobbying, patronage or campaign donations as 'bribery' or 'corruption'. No no no no. Democracy is messy and involves horse-trading, negotiation and balancing of many interest groups to push political priorities.
  - Retric 5y ago
    I don’t mean campaign donations to support candidates who agree with your cause. I mean strait up bribery where you hand people cash to do stuff for you.

trhway 5y ago

Marlon Brando look alikes have the right to lobby too. It doesn't make them any less evil.

macspoofing 5y ago
We are talking about inexpensive tax software as an alternative to free filing methods. It's not a big deal. Of course it could be more efficient and cheaper ... but so can many government programs. Are public sector unions evil when they negotiate outrageous contracts that the public has to pick up the tab for? This is what democracy looks like.
- Miraste 5y ago
  This very article explains how they're deliberately blocking millions of desperately impoverished people from receiving billions of dollars. How is that not a big deal?
  - macspoofing 5y ago
    >they're deliberately blocking millions of desperately impoverished people from receiving billions of dollars. They aren't. Those programs don't require Intuit to claim.
    - Falling3 5y ago
      The problem isn't that Intuit wants to charge something instead or nothing. The filing fee is not the harmful part. The problem is they can't directly ensure people use their service. But they can indirectly make it hard to file without using their service by lobbying against tax code simplications that would benefit most fillers. Your argument makes it sound like you do not know what the issue in question actually is.
    - Miraste 5y ago
      Recipients' other options are hire a CPA (obviously untenable), find the correct forms, calculate the credit themselves, do the rest of their returns by hand, and submit those (difficult for the target groups) or... pay to use TurboTax. That's the exact dilemma this new site would've helped solve if it hadn't been sabotaged.
      - macspoofing 5y ago
        > (difficult for the target groups) Why? My father is an immigrant, speaks with broken English and has no higher education ... and did his taxes for years with forms. Which target group are you referring to?
        Miraste 5y ago
        I'm referring to people with incomes low enough to qualify for the CTC. About half of US adults are functionally illiterate and innumerate, even measured by the Department of Education's (low) standards, and this correlates highly with income. I'm happy your father was able to do his own taxes, but he's not representative.
- trhway 5y ago
  > Are public sector unions evil when they negotiate outrageous contracts that the public has to pick up the tab for? the question starts to sound more interesting when you add the fact that the members of that union have "death or life" power over the public. >This is what democracy looks like. it is more like a "contract you can't refuse".

Retric 5y ago

It’s fine to lobby for a group say fisherman or “the rich.” However, when you’re getting special laws written to hand your company money at the expense of everyone else in the country that’s corruption not lobbying.

Retric 5y ago

Bribery isn’t lobbying.

macspoofing 5y ago
Lobbying is lobbying. There is a tendency by some purist to label democratic actions like lobbying, patronage or campaign donations as 'bribery' or 'corruption'. No no no no. Democracy is messy and involves horse-trading, negotiation and balancing of many interest groups to push political priorities.
- Retric 5y ago
  I don’t mean campaign donations to support candidates who agree with your cause. I mean strait up bribery where you hand people cash to do stuff for you.