4 ms·

>The first mistake is failing to recognize that many governments (case in point) are not nearly as vulnerable to bad PR, I mean we're talking about the same go

by xxpor 5y ago

>The first mistake is failing to recognize that many governments (case in point) are not nearly as vulnerable to bad PR, I mean we're talking about the same government on the bad side of the Tank Man photo. I think that's kind of obvious. The difference is in HK I don't think people were anticipating China to completely break the Basic Law and the handover agreement. They were protesting the elected HK government, not Beijing directly.

tablespoon 5y ago
> They were protesting the elected HK government, not Beijing directly. I don't think it's ever been correct to say the HK government was elected. It had some elected elements, but they were never in the majority: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legislative_Council_of_Hong_Kong#Membership_composition https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legislative_Council_of_Hong_Ko.... IIRC, one of the five protest demands was for a fully elected government.
- xxpor 5y ago
  The FCs are elected, but by people in the function it sounds like. That's an election, a weird one, but still an election. I'm sure Beijing was pulling the strings but it's not like they were directly appointed.
  - tablespoon 5y ago
    > That's an election, a weird one, but still an election. I'm sure Beijing was pulling the strings but it's not like they were directly appointed. IIRC, they're structured so Bejing's allies would control those seats, with few exceptions (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Education_(constituency) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Education_(constituency)). I think most of the "voters" are representatives of industry associations and the like.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
lions_share 5y ago
Not to discount China's horrible authoritarianism in Hong Kong or elsewhere, but the tank man photo is a selective propaganda edit. Watch the whole video (as captured by CNN): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YeFzeNAHEhU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YeFzeNAHEhU
bawolff 5y ago
But its also not nothing, otherwise they wouldn't be so sensitive on the subject.
- guerrilla 5y ago
  "If the situation was hopeless, their propaganda would be unnecessary"
baybal2 5y ago
> They were protesting the elected HK government, not Beijing directly. HK government was never elected. Beijing was always pulling strings from behind
karmasimida 5y ago
> They were protesting the elected HK government, not Beijing directly This wasn't case in later stages of the protest, or even early stages. The protestors were gambling against Beijing in the first place, since they clearly didn't trust the local governance nor its ability to meet their demands. And it kinda made it obvious for the latter stage of the protest, that the attack was focus on CCP directly.
rorykoehler 5y ago
Over 1 million marched against the 2nd Gulf war in London and it was pointless. Anyone who was paying attention knew the wmd evidence was most likely fabricated. It's the same all over the world.

by xxpor 5y ago

tablespoon 5y ago

> They were protesting the elected HK government, not Beijing directly. I don't think it's ever been correct to say the HK government was elected. It had some elected elements, but they were never in the majority: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legislative_Council_of_Hong_Kong#Membership_composition https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legislative_Council_of_Hong_Ko.... IIRC, one of the five protest demands was for a fully elected government.

xxpor 5y ago
The FCs are elected, but by people in the function it sounds like. That's an election, a weird one, but still an election. I'm sure Beijing was pulling the strings but it's not like they were directly appointed.
- tablespoon 5y ago
  > That's an election, a weird one, but still an election. I'm sure Beijing was pulling the strings but it's not like they were directly appointed. IIRC, they're structured so Bejing's allies would control those seats, with few exceptions (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Education_(constituency) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Education_(constituency)). I think most of the "voters" are representatives of industry associations and the like.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

lions_share 5y ago

Not to discount China's horrible authoritarianism in Hong Kong or elsewhere, but the tank man photo is a selective propaganda edit. Watch the whole video (as captured by CNN): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YeFzeNAHEhU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YeFzeNAHEhU

bawolff 5y ago

But its also not nothing, otherwise they wouldn't be so sensitive on the subject.

guerrilla 5y ago
"If the situation was hopeless, their propaganda would be unnecessary"

baybal2 5y ago

> They were protesting the elected HK government, not Beijing directly. HK government was never elected. Beijing was always pulling strings from behind

karmasimida 5y ago

> They were protesting the elected HK government, not Beijing directly This wasn't case in later stages of the protest, or even early stages. The protestors were gambling against Beijing in the first place, since they clearly didn't trust the local governance nor its ability to meet their demands. And it kinda made it obvious for the latter stage of the protest, that the attack was focus on CCP directly.

rorykoehler 5y ago

Over 1 million marched against the 2nd Gulf war in London and it was pointless. Anyone who was paying attention knew the wmd evidence was most likely fabricated. It's the same all over the world.