5 ms·

How about we bring back Sears' prefab housing?

by tomc1985 5y ago

mywittyname 5y ago
The standardization in the building trade didn't exist back in the Sears catalog days. For example, 2x4s come in 8ft lengths, using 16 on center studs, 8 2x4s will provide 8 foot of wall, and two sheets of drywall will cover it. And you can order all of the cabinetry, trim, shower enclosures, etc in a form that's ready for installation. A Sears prefab home would not be cheaper today because the inefficiencies that they solved in the early 1900s are no longer a problem. That, and it's infeasible for a person to construct their own house anymore, given building codes and such. Cookie cutter homes can be ridiculously cheap to build if done correctly. In really large developments, it's common for teams to move from house to house every day. Almost like an assembly line. This cuts down on a tremendous amount of wasted time.
- bigthymer 5y ago
  > it's infeasible for a person to construct their own house anymore, given building codes and such What has changed that this is no longer possible any more?
  - bluGill 5y ago
    You need to be a licensed plumber to touch anything that connects to the public water supply. While there is nothing hard about plumbing, doing something stupid could poison the whole town and so towns are paranoid. For everything else, you can do all the work yourself if you have time. I've done framing as a job so I have the experience to build a wall about as fast as any professional crew. I do my own electrical work but it takes me much longer than a real electrician (it passes intersection, though I'm more likely to need to fix something and get a second inspection). I can plan and schedule all the contractors for anything I don't want to do myself, but my inexperience means I would need to pad the schedule a lot more than a general contractor (and the fact that I'm not a regular customer means I'm not top of their list to get my job done) Each city and sometimes inspectors have their own codes. Sometimes they are good things (going beyond the basic codes), sometimes the inspector is just making things to enforce even though there is no engineering reason for that. There is no reason you can't build your own house (except plumbing). However it will take a lot of effort. Professionals are up on all the codes and the latest tricks and so will be a lot faster.
    - unethical_ban 5y ago
      >doing something stupid could poison the whole town and so towns are paranoid. Why not have a backflow preventer at the mains and call it a day? I get electricians in a way, but plumbing... eh.
      - EricE 5y ago
        There is more to it than that. The trades are a huge protection racket, and the municipalities are in on it. Yes, there are aspects of specialized knowledge where an actual tradesman provides significant value - but a lot of the bureaucracy exists to favor the incumbents, not to necessarily ensure you are getting a better or safer product. Insert the George Carlin quote about clubs here...
    - EricE 5y ago
      >Professionals are up on all the codes and the latest tricks and so will be a lot faster. "Professionals" also get preferential treatment from municipal governments. I'm pretty sure the only thing my local building inspector did was sign paperwork - good thing I found an actual home inspector that had a construction background because he found electrical, plumbing and framing issues so glaring it's obvious the local building inspectors "inspected" from the curb only :p My parents built the house I grew up in and over the years I've helped several friends build their own houses and the amount of trivial crap they had to put up from drunk on power building inspectors is nuts by comparison. It's an utter farce. The problem is very few people will ever experience it, so it's easy to not even realize what's going on. Until a large condo suddenly collapses in the middle of the night :p
      - bluGill 5y ago
        Different cities have different inspectors. However you should take up local politics if professionals are getting better treatment for crap work. That said, my experience with inspectors is they know who are the good ones and who are the bad ones. The bad ones get everything looked over closely. The good ones get a close look once in a while, but if the inspector is busy a quick look is all they will get. Trust comes from the inspectors experience in this case though, something that one off homeowners obviously haven't earned.
  - mywittyname 5y ago
    Well, I said infeasible, not impossible. You can do a large chunk of the work yourself (with a crew). But utility hookups are a no-no without a license. And you'll probably need to hire a crane operator at some point. Plus, there are a ton of building codes in regions that are different from other regions. So you'd better get those all right unless you enjoy rework.
kova12 5y ago
would be pretty expensive if made up to code. Also, something many of us are forgetting about: value of house is mostly not a structure. Having this house on 1/8 acre lot in the middle of desert would be horrible. You need water, sewer, power, internet, grocery stores, farms, parks, hospitals, gyms, coffee shops, theaters, airports. Structure alone wouldn't provide for this. It's the access to all the infrastructure that makes home so valuable

How about we bring back Sears' prefab housing?

The standardization in the building trade didn't exist back in the Sears catalog days. For example, 2x4s come in 8ft lengths, using 16 on center studs, 8 2x4s will provide 8 foot of wall, and two sheets of drywall will cover it. And you can order all of the cabinetry, trim, shower enclosures, etc in a form that's ready for installation. A Sears prefab home would not be cheaper today because the inefficiencies that they solved in the early 1900s are no longer a problem. That, and it's infeasible for a person to construct their own house anymore, given building codes and such. Cookie cutter homes can be ridiculously cheap to build if done correctly. In really large developments, it's common for teams to move from house to house every day. Almost like an assembly line. This cuts down on a tremendous amount of wasted time.

bigthymer 5y ago
> it's infeasible for a person to construct their own house anymore, given building codes and such What has changed that this is no longer possible any more?
- bluGill 5y ago
  You need to be a licensed plumber to touch anything that connects to the public water supply. While there is nothing hard about plumbing, doing something stupid could poison the whole town and so towns are paranoid. For everything else, you can do all the work yourself if you have time. I've done framing as a job so I have the experience to build a wall about as fast as any professional crew. I do my own electrical work but it takes me much longer than a real electrician (it passes intersection, though I'm more likely to need to fix something and get a second inspection). I can plan and schedule all the contractors for anything I don't want to do myself, but my inexperience means I would need to pad the schedule a lot more than a general contractor (and the fact that I'm not a regular customer means I'm not top of their list to get my job done) Each city and sometimes inspectors have their own codes. Sometimes they are good things (going beyond the basic codes), sometimes the inspector is just making things to enforce even though there is no engineering reason for that. There is no reason you can't build your own house (except plumbing). However it will take a lot of effort. Professionals are up on all the codes and the latest tricks and so will be a lot faster.
  - unethical_ban 5y ago
    >doing something stupid could poison the whole town and so towns are paranoid. Why not have a backflow preventer at the mains and call it a day? I get electricians in a way, but plumbing... eh.
    - EricE 5y ago
      There is more to it than that. The trades are a huge protection racket, and the municipalities are in on it. Yes, there are aspects of specialized knowledge where an actual tradesman provides significant value - but a lot of the bureaucracy exists to favor the incumbents, not to necessarily ensure you are getting a better or safer product. Insert the George Carlin quote about clubs here...
  - EricE 5y ago
    >Professionals are up on all the codes and the latest tricks and so will be a lot faster. "Professionals" also get preferential treatment from municipal governments. I'm pretty sure the only thing my local building inspector did was sign paperwork - good thing I found an actual home inspector that had a construction background because he found electrical, plumbing and framing issues so glaring it's obvious the local building inspectors "inspected" from the curb only :p My parents built the house I grew up in and over the years I've helped several friends build their own houses and the amount of trivial crap they had to put up from drunk on power building inspectors is nuts by comparison. It's an utter farce. The problem is very few people will ever experience it, so it's easy to not even realize what's going on. Until a large condo suddenly collapses in the middle of the night :p
    - bluGill 5y ago
      Different cities have different inspectors. However you should take up local politics if professionals are getting better treatment for crap work. That said, my experience with inspectors is they know who are the good ones and who are the bad ones. The bad ones get everything looked over closely. The good ones get a close look once in a while, but if the inspector is busy a quick look is all they will get. Trust comes from the inspectors experience in this case though, something that one off homeowners obviously haven't earned.
- mywittyname 5y ago
  Well, I said infeasible, not impossible. You can do a large chunk of the work yourself (with a crew). But utility hookups are a no-no without a license. And you'll probably need to hire a crane operator at some point. Plus, there are a ton of building codes in regions that are different from other regions. So you'd better get those all right unless you enjoy rework.

kova12 5y ago

would be pretty expensive if made up to code. Also, something many of us are forgetting about: value of house is mostly not a structure. Having this house on 1/8 acre lot in the middle of desert would be horrible. You need water, sewer, power, internet, grocery stores, farms, parks, hospitals, gyms, coffee shops, theaters, airports. Structure alone wouldn't provide for this. It's the access to all the infrastructure that makes home so valuable