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Thank you for your answer. The reason I wanted to give this test is that I think we may be experiencing the same thing, but interpreting what we see differently

Thank you for your answer. The reason I wanted to give this test is that I think we may be experiencing the same thing, but interpreting what we see differently. I too can recall scenes from my last holiday trip. I can "see" the night time scene at the bar, the placement of me and my friends around the table, the lady in a white shirt delivering our drinks -- but it's not the same as a real photograph. It's a different type of vision altogether. It's possible that there are people who are experiencing the same thing as I am, but are describing what they are seeing as a clear photograph. My argument is that it's not a clear photograph if you can't inspect any details.

the_af 5y ago
Oh, agreed. It's not as clear as a photograph and you have to make an effort to "pin down" the image. In fact, I suspect many of my mental images are inaccurate and my brain is making some stuff up. I'm not claiming to have perfect recall, just that I see visual imagery with my mind :)
the_af 5y ago
Out of curiosity, can you also not hear "vivid" music in your mind? My friend can't, at best he can "hear" himself mumbling something resembling the original piece. I however can hear passages of music I remember well: the opening from Star Wars, parts of Kind of Blue or songs from Pink Floyd, the intro song of many TV shows, etc. I probably cannot pass a test equivalent to the crossword puzzle either, but I definitely can hear the music and it's not just me mumbling in my head.
- dorkwood 5y ago
  Interesting question! I can "hear" the Star Wars theme, and the brass and strings or whatever it is that makes that iconic sound, but it's not the same as the real thing. I think the best way to describe it is that the music and images in my head are both experienced with the same level of clarity as my inner-monologue. My inner-monologue doesn't sound like a real voice in the room with me. As in, there's no way to confuse it with real sound. But it has the same tone and feel as my own voice, just as the music in my head has the same tone and feel as the real music. This is where I think the difference in description is happening between myself and others. I've experienced both visual and auditory hallucinations before. These are indistinguishable from real images and sounds. When I picture things, play music, or talk out-loud in my own head, it's not the same as reality. It's a different type of seeing and hearing. Some people seem to imply that their imagination capabilities are on the same level as hallucinations. They say they can picture things with picture-perfect clarity, right there in the same room with them. I even had one artist say he could overlay an image on a piece of paper with his mind and then trace over it. I have another test I'd like to ask these people: is it possible to picture a black square that sits in front of your eyes and obscures your whole vision? If not, why not?
  - the_af 5y ago
    I get what you're saying. This visual imagery as well as the sounds are NOT hallucinations. You cannot mistake them for the real thing. I cannot replace Spotify with my mind (that would be awesome though!) It's just a very vivid and detailed experience, but it absolutely cannot be confused with the real thing like an hallucination can. I can see geometric shapes of all colors but they don't obscure my vision. They "bypass" my vision and go through a different "channel". I cannot confuse myself and suddenly think there's a floating black square in front of me.
- garmaine 5y ago
  Not the person you are replying to, but I’m like your friend, and also lack visual imagination. In fact the only thing I can create in my head is my internal monologue. Ask me to remember a tune and I’ll be internally beat boxing or humming it with my inner monologue voice. That’s the only musical “inner ear” I have. I am also tone deaf, which maybe related, and suck at visual arts.
  - dorkwood 5y ago
    I can hear instruments, but after reading about the humming guy I could suddenly only hear myself hum. I had to force myself to switch back to instruments, like some sort of optical illusion. This makes me think it could be a learned ability.

the_af 5y ago

Oh, agreed. It's not as clear as a photograph and you have to make an effort to "pin down" the image. In fact, I suspect many of my mental images are inaccurate and my brain is making some stuff up. I'm not claiming to have perfect recall, just that I see visual imagery with my mind :)

the_af 5y ago

Out of curiosity, can you also not hear "vivid" music in your mind? My friend can't, at best he can "hear" himself mumbling something resembling the original piece. I however can hear passages of music I remember well: the opening from Star Wars, parts of Kind of Blue or songs from Pink Floyd, the intro song of many TV shows, etc. I probably cannot pass a test equivalent to the crossword puzzle either, but I definitely can hear the music and it's not just me mumbling in my head.

dorkwood 5y ago
Interesting question! I can "hear" the Star Wars theme, and the brass and strings or whatever it is that makes that iconic sound, but it's not the same as the real thing. I think the best way to describe it is that the music and images in my head are both experienced with the same level of clarity as my inner-monologue. My inner-monologue doesn't sound like a real voice in the room with me. As in, there's no way to confuse it with real sound. But it has the same tone and feel as my own voice, just as the music in my head has the same tone and feel as the real music. This is where I think the difference in description is happening between myself and others. I've experienced both visual and auditory hallucinations before. These are indistinguishable from real images and sounds. When I picture things, play music, or talk out-loud in my own head, it's not the same as reality. It's a different type of seeing and hearing. Some people seem to imply that their imagination capabilities are on the same level as hallucinations. They say they can picture things with picture-perfect clarity, right there in the same room with them. I even had one artist say he could overlay an image on a piece of paper with his mind and then trace over it. I have another test I'd like to ask these people: is it possible to picture a black square that sits in front of your eyes and obscures your whole vision? If not, why not?
- the_af 5y ago
  I get what you're saying. This visual imagery as well as the sounds are NOT hallucinations. You cannot mistake them for the real thing. I cannot replace Spotify with my mind (that would be awesome though!) It's just a very vivid and detailed experience, but it absolutely cannot be confused with the real thing like an hallucination can. I can see geometric shapes of all colors but they don't obscure my vision. They "bypass" my vision and go through a different "channel". I cannot confuse myself and suddenly think there's a floating black square in front of me.
garmaine 5y ago
Not the person you are replying to, but I’m like your friend, and also lack visual imagination. In fact the only thing I can create in my head is my internal monologue. Ask me to remember a tune and I’ll be internally beat boxing or humming it with my inner monologue voice. That’s the only musical “inner ear” I have. I am also tone deaf, which maybe related, and suck at visual arts.
- dorkwood 5y ago
  I can hear instruments, but after reading about the humming guy I could suddenly only hear myself hum. I had to force myself to switch back to instruments, like some sort of optical illusion. This makes me think it could be a learned ability.