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Indeed. It should be the goal of society to automate away as much work as possible. If there are perverse incentives working against this then we should correct

Indeed. It should be the goal of society to automate away as much work as possible. If there are perverse incentives working against this then we should correct them.

gugagore 5y ago
1. How do you define work differently from "that which should be automated"? 2. While I agree with your stance, it is not by itself sufficient. If you provide the automation but you do not correct the perverse incentives (or you worry about correcting them only later) that you mention, then you are contributing to widening the disparity between a category of workers (who have now lost their leverage) and those with assets and capital (who have a reduced need for workers).
- AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
  I agree, the fact we're even talking about this is evidence that our society has the perverse incentive baked in and we should be aware of and seek to address that. Regardless, programmers would be hypocritical to decry having their jobs automated away.
- mkr-hn 5y ago
  That's why it's best to get unions or support systems (like UBI) before they're needed. It's hard to organize and build systems when you have no leverage, influence, or power left.
- literallycancer 5y ago
  Why is the disparity bad?
  - gugagore 5y ago
    What do you mean by "bad"? If you're asking why it makes sense to structure society with an eye toward avoiding disparity, then it's enough to just observe empirically that people have an aversion to unfair treatment. And not just people: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_inequity_aversion https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_inequity_aversion If you're asking why do people respond the way they do to disparity, then I can only speculate that it has something to do with the meaning of life.
spec-obs 5y ago
I would be up for that, if said society did not leave us destitute as a result
amw-zero 5y ago
Human beings need something to do to have a fulfilling life. I do not agree at all that the ultimate goal of society is to automate everything that’s possible. I think that will be horrible overall for society.
- kyawzazaw 5y ago
  I typically find other things fulfill my life more than work.
- AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
  My job is probably the least fulfilling activity in my life and I'm sure that goes for a lot of people. By your reasoning, maybe we don't need backhoes and should just hire a bunch of guys with spoons instead?

Indeed. It should be the goal of society to automate away as much work as possible. If there are perverse incentives working against this then we should correct them.

gugagore 5y ago

1. How do you define work differently from "that which should be automated"? 2. While I agree with your stance, it is not by itself sufficient. If you provide the automation but you do not correct the perverse incentives (or you worry about correcting them only later) that you mention, then you are contributing to widening the disparity between a category of workers (who have now lost their leverage) and those with assets and capital (who have a reduced need for workers).

AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
I agree, the fact we're even talking about this is evidence that our society has the perverse incentive baked in and we should be aware of and seek to address that. Regardless, programmers would be hypocritical to decry having their jobs automated away.
mkr-hn 5y ago
That's why it's best to get unions or support systems (like UBI) before they're needed. It's hard to organize and build systems when you have no leverage, influence, or power left.
literallycancer 5y ago
Why is the disparity bad?
- gugagore 5y ago
  What do you mean by "bad"? If you're asking why it makes sense to structure society with an eye toward avoiding disparity, then it's enough to just observe empirically that people have an aversion to unfair treatment. And not just people: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_inequity_aversion https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_inequity_aversion If you're asking why do people respond the way they do to disparity, then I can only speculate that it has something to do with the meaning of life.

spec-obs 5y ago

I would be up for that, if said society did not leave us destitute as a result

amw-zero 5y ago

Human beings need something to do to have a fulfilling life. I do not agree at all that the ultimate goal of society is to automate everything that’s possible. I think that will be horrible overall for society.

kyawzazaw 5y ago
I typically find other things fulfill my life more than work.
AnIdiotOnTheNet 5y ago
My job is probably the least fulfilling activity in my life and I'm sure that goes for a lot of people. By your reasoning, maybe we don't need backhoes and should just hire a bunch of guys with spoons instead?