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>If you tell people that if they work 12+ hours a day in their 20s that they would be millionaires In software development this is a realistic goal if you play

>If you tell people that if they work 12+ hours a day in their 20s that they would be millionaires In software development this is a realistic goal if you play your cards right. Plenty of other careers too. I think there's also statistical data to support this as well (hours worked early on increasing your income and net worth down the line). Working hard early on in your career does pay off.

xyzelement 5y ago
You got downvoted not because you are wrong but because you are right. Some people would rather hear they have no power and no chance because it takes away the bad feeling for their own agency in their situation. Others are empowered by their agency and act on it. Thank you for spreading the 2nd point of view.
- giantg2 5y ago
  https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/beautiful-minds/the-role-of-luck-in-life-success-is-far-greater-than-we-realized/ https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/beautiful-minds/the-rol...
giantg2 5y ago
I haven't seen it personally. I've done everything "right" in life and I still get screwed 10 ways. Do you have any links to the data you mention?
- luffapi 5y ago
  I totally agree. If you want to get ahead, you need to “hack” the system by convincing people in the upper class that you belong there too. Working hard is a great way to signal that you’re middle class labor.
luffapi 5y ago
As someone who has gone from being poor to being upper middle class via the tech industry, I can say without exception hard work had nothing to do with it. Every quantum leap in my career came from convincing some rich guy to allow me to bask in the mist of the cash firehose being directed at them. I would say working hard is actually negatively associated with success. Once you get branded a “worker bee”, your chances for high level advancement quickly bottom out. If you really want to get ahead go to the right parties. The VP no one can ever get a hold of is making an order of magnitude more money then the middle manager putting in 80 hours a week. That person will correctly have been identified by the execs as not belonging to the upper class. That being said, once you see how the game is played it can be hard to stomach. It is reality though.
- reader_mode 5y ago
  That's not what I'm getting at. You can accumulate >1M net worth just by being an engineer/contractor - no need to get into upper management or socialise with rich people. Working on acquiring experience early on in your career will accelerate the point where you're making decent money where you're able to save/invest a decent portion of your income. Your path doesn't sound widely reproducible.
  - luffapi 5y ago
    You don’t need to work hard to acquire that much money as an engineer. You can totally coast and make market salary. The hard part is going to be having the discipline to save and live beneath your means.
    - username90 5y ago
      You have to work hard to get the job in the first place. A large majority of people can't even get through the basics of learning to code so can't even get a degree or do the basics to get a job as a self learner. To them getting a software engineering job is too much hard work and they instead just continue earning their poor salaries.
      - luffapi 5y ago
        I love programming and know a dozen languages. I learned them for fun and didn’t consider it work. I also know people who know a little Python or JS and can make >$100k a year. You may have to learn a bare minimum to get in the door, you may consider that hard work or not, but once in, you no longer need to work hard. Sweet talking your boss or jumping jobs will get you way more bang for your buck.

xyzelement 5y ago

You got downvoted not because you are wrong but because you are right. Some people would rather hear they have no power and no chance because it takes away the bad feeling for their own agency in their situation. Others are empowered by their agency and act on it. Thank you for spreading the 2nd point of view.

giantg2 5y ago
https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/beautiful-minds/the-role-of-luck-in-life-success-is-far-greater-than-we-realized/ https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/beautiful-minds/the-rol...

giantg2 5y ago

I haven't seen it personally. I've done everything "right" in life and I still get screwed 10 ways. Do you have any links to the data you mention?

luffapi 5y ago
I totally agree. If you want to get ahead, you need to “hack” the system by convincing people in the upper class that you belong there too. Working hard is a great way to signal that you’re middle class labor.

luffapi 5y ago

As someone who has gone from being poor to being upper middle class via the tech industry, I can say without exception hard work had nothing to do with it. Every quantum leap in my career came from convincing some rich guy to allow me to bask in the mist of the cash firehose being directed at them. I would say working hard is actually negatively associated with success. Once you get branded a “worker bee”, your chances for high level advancement quickly bottom out. If you really want to get ahead go to the right parties. The VP no one can ever get a hold of is making an order of magnitude more money then the middle manager putting in 80 hours a week. That person will correctly have been identified by the execs as not belonging to the upper class. That being said, once you see how the game is played it can be hard to stomach. It is reality though.

reader_mode 5y ago
That's not what I'm getting at. You can accumulate >1M net worth just by being an engineer/contractor - no need to get into upper management or socialise with rich people. Working on acquiring experience early on in your career will accelerate the point where you're making decent money where you're able to save/invest a decent portion of your income. Your path doesn't sound widely reproducible.
- luffapi 5y ago
  You don’t need to work hard to acquire that much money as an engineer. You can totally coast and make market salary. The hard part is going to be having the discipline to save and live beneath your means.
  - username90 5y ago
    You have to work hard to get the job in the first place. A large majority of people can't even get through the basics of learning to code so can't even get a degree or do the basics to get a job as a self learner. To them getting a software engineering job is too much hard work and they instead just continue earning their poor salaries.
    - luffapi 5y ago
      I love programming and know a dozen languages. I learned them for fun and didn’t consider it work. I also know people who know a little Python or JS and can make >$100k a year. You may have to learn a bare minimum to get in the door, you may consider that hard work or not, but once in, you no longer need to work hard. Sweet talking your boss or jumping jobs will get you way more bang for your buck.