6 ms·

>The reason these wait staff get tips is because they work so hard The reason they get tips is because they are waitstaff, it has zero to do with how hard they

by astura 5y ago

>The reason these wait staff get tips is because they work so hard The reason they get tips is because they are waitstaff, it has zero to do with how hard they work, it's simply custom to tip waitstaff, even lazy waitstaff. Most employees work just as hard without getting tips (like the people who are actually cooking the food).

monkeynotes 5y ago
Maybe for you, I tip extra for working hard to keep my meal hot on delivery, water topped up, checking in at appropriate times. I honestly don't understand how you can say tips are not proportional to level of service and how level of service is entirely detached from working hard. > Most people work just as hard without getting tips (like the people who are actually cooking thr food) Most people get paid a real wage which isn't backfilled with charity from their customers. At many good restaurants tips are distributed to the kitchen staff too. Obviously I have no control over that, and the world isn't fair either. None of this changes my argument.
- astura 5y ago
  > I tip extra for working hard to keep my meal hot on delivery, water topped up, checking in at appropriate times. Those are things happen with good management, they have little to do with how hard an individual employee is working at a given time. Besides the claim wasn't waitstaff gets "extra" tips for working hard, the claim was that waitstaff is tipped because they work hard. Don't move the goalposts. >I honestly don't understand how you can say tips are not proportional to level of service and how level of service is entirely detached from working hard. I tip the same if my service is shitty, I am not going to put an individual employee in a position of taking a pay cut when I can't know the exact reason something went wrong. I don't know enough about their operations to be punishing individual employees. Even if I could tell if it were an individual employee's fault, most places pool tips, so I'd be punishing the other employees working at the same time. So everyone gets the same tip from me. I also simply just don't enjoy LARPing as a lord of my personal fiefdom. Again, you get good service with good management, simple as that.
  - monkeynotes 5y ago
    > waitstaff gets "extra" tips for working hard All tips are 'extra' that's the whole concept. It's money on top of what I am obliged to pay. > you get good service with good management Good management would pay a good wage and negate the need for tipping. > I also simply just don't enjoy LARPing as a lord of my personal fiefdom. Low blow. You are implying that I am less than you because I have some kind of financial control over waitstaff that I enjoy. A rather bad faith position to be in given how pious and understanding you are striving to come across as. > most places pool tips So now you agree kitchen staff get tipped too > I tip the same if my service is shitty Good for you. I don't think many people operate like this, so I'd say you are an edge case. > it has zero to do with how hard they work, it's simply custom to tip waitstaff, even lazy waitstaff Again, this is how you operate. Wikipedia lays out the common perception of tipping "The customary amount of a tip can be a specific range of monetary amounts or a certain percentage of the bill based on the perceived quality of the service given." I've experienced living in the UK without tipping, and in N.America with tipping. All I can say is it's night and day. Very few make a career out of working as waitstaff in the UK, plenty of people have a career in the service industry in N.America. Working hard for large tips can give you a living wage. In the UK because everyone is treated the same, waitstaff do the minimum for the minimum wage (there are exceptions, of course) and then find a better job. Since I left the UK this has begun to change, it's now reasonably common to tip in nicer restaurants, and guess what? The service is better and the waitstaff I assume are happier with more money in their pockets for their effort.
  - msrenee 5y ago
    I will admit that I gave a really shitty tip the other week. I ordered the salad bar. All she had to do was refill my pop and settle the bill. She dropped the check off and didn't come back for 15 minutes. I walked over to the bar area to find someone to run my card and she was bullshitting with another employee. Yeah, no. I make it a point to tip well and just consider that part of the cost of my food. Not this time. I rounded up to the next dollar and I don't know why I even did that.
grumple 5y ago
Perhaps you are unaware, but in the US, tipped waitstaff only make $2.83/hr in most places (tipped minimum wage). These people need tips in order to make any money. Nobody is working hard for 2.83/hr. This is changing since now people are refusing to work those jobs. And yes, the entire industry is dumb and corrupt for having this practice in the first place, but it is what it is.
- dragonwriter 5y ago
  > Perhaps you are unaware, but in the US, tipped waitstaff only make $2.83/hr in most places (tipped minimum wage). Perhaps you are unaware, but: (1) US federal tipped minimum cash wage is $2.13, not $2.83, but also (2) Most US states and territories have a tipped minimum wage above the federal tipped minimum (and also, though by a smaller margin, most have a tipped minimum above $2.83, which is PA’s tipped minimum.) https://www.dol.gov/agencies/whd/state/minimum-wage/tipped https://www.dol.gov/agencies/whd/state/minimum-wage/tipped
  - grumple 5y ago
    Sorry, you're right, a quick google search revealed my state's wage, not the fed (forgot to check the difference, which is so negligible that it's insulting). This does not change my point in the slightest, which is that wait staff need tips to survive because the tipped minimum wage is unlivable basically everywhere.
    - dragonwriter 5y ago
      > This does not change my point in the slightest, which is that wait staff need tips to survive because the tipped minimum wage is unlivable basically everywhere. Its the same as the general minimum in several places, and at or above the federal general (not just tipped) minimum even more, so if its unlivable “basically everywhere” that's more than just a tipped minimum problem.
      - grumple 5y ago

by astura 5y ago

monkeynotes 5y ago

Maybe for you, I tip extra for working hard to keep my meal hot on delivery, water topped up, checking in at appropriate times. I honestly don't understand how you can say tips are not proportional to level of service and how level of service is entirely detached from working hard. > Most people work just as hard without getting tips (like the people who are actually cooking thr food) Most people get paid a real wage which isn't backfilled with charity from their customers. At many good restaurants tips are distributed to the kitchen staff too. Obviously I have no control over that, and the world isn't fair either. None of this changes my argument.

astura 5y ago
> I tip extra for working hard to keep my meal hot on delivery, water topped up, checking in at appropriate times. Those are things happen with good management, they have little to do with how hard an individual employee is working at a given time. Besides the claim wasn't waitstaff gets "extra" tips for working hard, the claim was that waitstaff is tipped because they work hard. Don't move the goalposts. >I honestly don't understand how you can say tips are not proportional to level of service and how level of service is entirely detached from working hard. I tip the same if my service is shitty, I am not going to put an individual employee in a position of taking a pay cut when I can't know the exact reason something went wrong. I don't know enough about their operations to be punishing individual employees. Even if I could tell if it were an individual employee's fault, most places pool tips, so I'd be punishing the other employees working at the same time. So everyone gets the same tip from me. I also simply just don't enjoy LARPing as a lord of my personal fiefdom. Again, you get good service with good management, simple as that.
- monkeynotes 5y ago
  > waitstaff gets "extra" tips for working hard All tips are 'extra' that's the whole concept. It's money on top of what I am obliged to pay. > you get good service with good management Good management would pay a good wage and negate the need for tipping. > I also simply just don't enjoy LARPing as a lord of my personal fiefdom. Low blow. You are implying that I am less than you because I have some kind of financial control over waitstaff that I enjoy. A rather bad faith position to be in given how pious and understanding you are striving to come across as. > most places pool tips So now you agree kitchen staff get tipped too > I tip the same if my service is shitty Good for you. I don't think many people operate like this, so I'd say you are an edge case. > it has zero to do with how hard they work, it's simply custom to tip waitstaff, even lazy waitstaff Again, this is how you operate. Wikipedia lays out the common perception of tipping "The customary amount of a tip can be a specific range of monetary amounts or a certain percentage of the bill based on the perceived quality of the service given." I've experienced living in the UK without tipping, and in N.America with tipping. All I can say is it's night and day. Very few make a career out of working as waitstaff in the UK, plenty of people have a career in the service industry in N.America. Working hard for large tips can give you a living wage. In the UK because everyone is treated the same, waitstaff do the minimum for the minimum wage (there are exceptions, of course) and then find a better job. Since I left the UK this has begun to change, it's now reasonably common to tip in nicer restaurants, and guess what? The service is better and the waitstaff I assume are happier with more money in their pockets for their effort.
- msrenee 5y ago
  I will admit that I gave a really shitty tip the other week. I ordered the salad bar. All she had to do was refill my pop and settle the bill. She dropped the check off and didn't come back for 15 minutes. I walked over to the bar area to find someone to run my card and she was bullshitting with another employee. Yeah, no. I make it a point to tip well and just consider that part of the cost of my food. Not this time. I rounded up to the next dollar and I don't know why I even did that.

grumple 5y ago

Perhaps you are unaware, but in the US, tipped waitstaff only make $2.83/hr in most places (tipped minimum wage). These people need tips in order to make any money. Nobody is working hard for 2.83/hr. This is changing since now people are refusing to work those jobs. And yes, the entire industry is dumb and corrupt for having this practice in the first place, but it is what it is.

dragonwriter 5y ago
> Perhaps you are unaware, but in the US, tipped waitstaff only make $2.83/hr in most places (tipped minimum wage). Perhaps you are unaware, but: (1) US federal tipped minimum cash wage is $2.13, not $2.83, but also (2) Most US states and territories have a tipped minimum wage above the federal tipped minimum (and also, though by a smaller margin, most have a tipped minimum above $2.83, which is PA’s tipped minimum.) https://www.dol.gov/agencies/whd/state/minimum-wage/tipped https://www.dol.gov/agencies/whd/state/minimum-wage/tipped
- grumple 5y ago
  Sorry, you're right, a quick google search revealed my state's wage, not the fed (forgot to check the difference, which is so negligible that it's insulting). This does not change my point in the slightest, which is that wait staff need tips to survive because the tipped minimum wage is unlivable basically everywhere.
  - dragonwriter 5y ago
    > This does not change my point in the slightest, which is that wait staff need tips to survive because the tipped minimum wage is unlivable basically everywhere. Its the same as the general minimum in several places, and at or above the federal general (not just tipped) minimum even more, so if its unlivable “basically everywhere” that's more than just a tipped minimum problem.
    - grumple 5y ago