4 ms·

> I really wonder how China was able to leap to sending a rover without lots of investment in understanding everything else about it. Continent-wide public edu

> I really wonder how China was able to leap to sending a rover without lots of investment in understanding everything else about it. Continent-wide public education churning out legions after legions of STEM graduates?

cscurmudgeon 5y ago
The best of which promptly move to US and Europe.
- onethought 5y ago
  I think you severely underestimate the quantity of top scoring STEM graduates. What you really mean is “the richest/privileged move to US and Europe”
sidlls 5y ago
The proportion of Chinese stem graduates who aren’t simply copying their way around and are gifted enough to run these programs is likely about the same as the proportion anywhere else. Chinese people are no more or less intelligent than anyone else.
- ptr2voidStar 5y ago
  Shocking that you have to state this fact. Is this HN or YouTube? SMDH
  - sidlls 5y ago
    On HN it seems like there is a huge anti-US/sinophile presence which seeks to elevate any achievement, no matter how minor or retread, as if it were some major accomplishment done in spite of insurmountable purposeful opposition by the evil colonial empire building westerners. When even the slightest accomplishment is so outlandishly propagandized it becomes hard to view actual ones in their proper light. Especially when it’s unclear whether they’re “standing on shoulders” or simply trying to pass the shoulders off as their own.
- wiz21c 5y ago
  In my country, and I guess otherd in western Europe, we often fail to appreciate the sheer power of those "other" countries such as Russia or China. Many are still stuck in the colonialist vision of things where Europe and US were vastly superior. This is not true anymore. And as you point out, intelligence is uniformly distributed.
  - failuser 5y ago
    Days when Russia could send problems to Mars are long over, so with regards to Russia reality ironically corrected itself to match the US expectations.
    - wiz21c 5y ago
      Well, I must admit picking Russia was a bit far fetched :-) However, I have the feeling Russia is still a strong player on the geopolitical level (see Syria, Ukraine -- although I'm sure civilian casualties say otherwise).
- blackoil 5y ago
  Not supporting OPs assertion, but. Even with same proportion they will have huge advantage in absolute nos. Also society and government are lot different, changing the way and proportion of people persevere for a particular career option.
  - jjcc 5y ago
    let's put ideology aside. It's quite interesting to watch different societies, governance, cultures evolving, cooperating,competing among each other. Eastern world is more likely have low entropy societies while Western have high entropy societies. Both have strength and weakness. Low entropy societies are more efficient, extremely good at building physical things. But tend to have less varieties. High societies are more chaotic, but also more innovative, more productive in spiritual domain. Not only in technologies but also arts ,etc. It would be ideal that both societies can cooperate and share the benefits leveraging advantages of both worlds. But in reality it's quite complex and not going to a good direction in short term
    - sudosysgen 5y ago
      This seems like a "just so" statement. Fifty years ago people would say that Western societies are more efficient and better at building physical things. So I don't really see it. I don't think Western societies are necessarily always going to be better at technology and I think you really, really underestimate the chaos and varieties of many non-Western societies. In many ways the West is quite low-entropy.

cscurmudgeon 5y ago

The best of which promptly move to US and Europe.

onethought 5y ago
I think you severely underestimate the quantity of top scoring STEM graduates. What you really mean is “the richest/privileged move to US and Europe”

sidlls 5y ago

The proportion of Chinese stem graduates who aren’t simply copying their way around and are gifted enough to run these programs is likely about the same as the proportion anywhere else. Chinese people are no more or less intelligent than anyone else.

ptr2voidStar 5y ago
Shocking that you have to state this fact. Is this HN or YouTube? SMDH
- sidlls 5y ago
  On HN it seems like there is a huge anti-US/sinophile presence which seeks to elevate any achievement, no matter how minor or retread, as if it were some major accomplishment done in spite of insurmountable purposeful opposition by the evil colonial empire building westerners. When even the slightest accomplishment is so outlandishly propagandized it becomes hard to view actual ones in their proper light. Especially when it’s unclear whether they’re “standing on shoulders” or simply trying to pass the shoulders off as their own.
wiz21c 5y ago
In my country, and I guess otherd in western Europe, we often fail to appreciate the sheer power of those "other" countries such as Russia or China. Many are still stuck in the colonialist vision of things where Europe and US were vastly superior. This is not true anymore. And as you point out, intelligence is uniformly distributed.
- failuser 5y ago
  Days when Russia could send problems to Mars are long over, so with regards to Russia reality ironically corrected itself to match the US expectations.
  - wiz21c 5y ago
    Well, I must admit picking Russia was a bit far fetched :-) However, I have the feeling Russia is still a strong player on the geopolitical level (see Syria, Ukraine -- although I'm sure civilian casualties say otherwise).
blackoil 5y ago
Not supporting OPs assertion, but. Even with same proportion they will have huge advantage in absolute nos. Also society and government are lot different, changing the way and proportion of people persevere for a particular career option.
- jjcc 5y ago
  let's put ideology aside. It's quite interesting to watch different societies, governance, cultures evolving, cooperating,competing among each other. Eastern world is more likely have low entropy societies while Western have high entropy societies. Both have strength and weakness. Low entropy societies are more efficient, extremely good at building physical things. But tend to have less varieties. High societies are more chaotic, but also more innovative, more productive in spiritual domain. Not only in technologies but also arts ,etc. It would be ideal that both societies can cooperate and share the benefits leveraging advantages of both worlds. But in reality it's quite complex and not going to a good direction in short term
  - sudosysgen 5y ago
    This seems like a "just so" statement. Fifty years ago people would say that Western societies are more efficient and better at building physical things. So I don't really see it. I don't think Western societies are necessarily always going to be better at technology and I think you really, really underestimate the chaos and varieties of many non-Western societies. In many ways the West is quite low-entropy.