3 ms·

> they're usually far from natural (tons of chemicals) I really object to marketing use of the word 'natural' and 'chemicals'. I don't mean to single you out -

by yaseer 5y ago

> they're usually far from natural (tons of chemicals) I really object to marketing use of the word 'natural' and 'chemicals'. I don't mean to single you out - these concepts are widespread in marketing. Plenty of 'natural' things are bad, like small pox, the Ebola virus and salmonella. Plenty of 'unnatural' things are good, like antibiotics to treat infection. All matter is made from chemicals. Whether a chemical like penicillin or salt is synthesised in a lab, or extracted from the ocean, holds no baring on whether that chemical is good for you. - EDIT - Generalised the penicillin example.

dariusj18 5y ago
I wouldn't say Penicillin is 'unnatural', there are probably better examples out there.
- yaseer 5y ago
  That's true, I just picked penicillin and salt intentionally as they both can be synthesised in a lab and in nature
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
hypertele-Xii 5y ago
Penicillin is a natural product of fungi against bacteria.
tomp 5y ago
When it comes to food, I use the following criteria: could I make it myself in my kitchen? (Some "minimal processsing" like fermentation and curing therefore fall under "natural".) I'm pretty sure the answer is "no" for most of the plant-based fake meat. It's also "no" for McDonald's burger so I'm not just hating on plants.
- distribot 5y ago
  I understand this conversation is about Beyond Meat kinda stuff, but it's isn't no for the two oldest and most popular fake meats--tofu and seitan. And yet tofu especially gets beat up in terms of fake vs natural.
  - jayparth 5y ago
    You can definitely make seitan in your kitchen, I am not disagreeing with anything you're saying though.
  - tomp 5y ago
    Tofu and seitan get "beat up" because (1) tofu is soy and seitan is gluten (many people dislike those, for various reasons), (2) they're often used to mimic (fake) meat, not made into creative meals of their own, and (3) for me personally, tofu is extremely bland.
  - telotortium 5y ago
    As an omnivore, I love seitan - it's pretty common in Chinese and Japanese cuisine. I wish more vegetarian places in the US would use it, but it seems that only tofu has crossed over, which is a shame, because tofu generally doesn't have the texture and bulk of meat, but rather of soft, non-meltable cheese, and is not even as filling as that.
    - impreciouschild 5y ago
      Lots of veg places in the US -do- use seitan. It may be your location that doesn't. It's very popular for vegan chicken sandwiches, fingers, wings, curries etc. I'm in LA tho which may be the current veg restaurant capital of the world.
- yaseer 5y ago
  It's definitely true highly processed foods correlate with poor health outcomes. This correlation is mainly because ultra-processed foods often contain added sugars, excess sodium, and unhealthy fats (source: https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/processed-foods/ https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/processed-foods...). There's an (open) question here of what the cause is; is this inherent to all food processing?, or is it the nutritional content of the food? I would argue eating home-made potato chips, cookies and ice cream may lead to worse health outcomes than plant-based burgers with better nutritional benefits

by yaseer 5y ago

dariusj18 5y ago

I wouldn't say Penicillin is 'unnatural', there are probably better examples out there.

yaseer 5y ago
That's true, I just picked penicillin and salt intentionally as they both can be synthesised in a lab and in nature

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

hypertele-Xii 5y ago

Penicillin is a natural product of fungi against bacteria.

tomp 5y ago

When it comes to food, I use the following criteria: could I make it myself in my kitchen? (Some "minimal processsing" like fermentation and curing therefore fall under "natural".) I'm pretty sure the answer is "no" for most of the plant-based fake meat. It's also "no" for McDonald's burger so I'm not just hating on plants.

distribot 5y ago
I understand this conversation is about Beyond Meat kinda stuff, but it's isn't no for the two oldest and most popular fake meats--tofu and seitan. And yet tofu especially gets beat up in terms of fake vs natural.
- jayparth 5y ago
  You can definitely make seitan in your kitchen, I am not disagreeing with anything you're saying though.
- tomp 5y ago
  Tofu and seitan get "beat up" because (1) tofu is soy and seitan is gluten (many people dislike those, for various reasons), (2) they're often used to mimic (fake) meat, not made into creative meals of their own, and (3) for me personally, tofu is extremely bland.
- telotortium 5y ago
  As an omnivore, I love seitan - it's pretty common in Chinese and Japanese cuisine. I wish more vegetarian places in the US would use it, but it seems that only tofu has crossed over, which is a shame, because tofu generally doesn't have the texture and bulk of meat, but rather of soft, non-meltable cheese, and is not even as filling as that.
  - impreciouschild 5y ago
    Lots of veg places in the US -do- use seitan. It may be your location that doesn't. It's very popular for vegan chicken sandwiches, fingers, wings, curries etc. I'm in LA tho which may be the current veg restaurant capital of the world.
yaseer 5y ago
It's definitely true highly processed foods correlate with poor health outcomes. This correlation is mainly because ultra-processed foods often contain added sugars, excess sodium, and unhealthy fats (source: https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/processed-foods/ https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/processed-foods...). There's an (open) question here of what the cause is; is this inherent to all food processing?, or is it the nutritional content of the food? I would argue eating home-made potato chips, cookies and ice cream may lead to worse health outcomes than plant-based burgers with better nutritional benefits