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But you can’t move these individual’s support networks also. Their friends, family, doctors. They might not have a permanent living space, but they may have a c

But you can’t move these individual’s support networks also. Their friends, family, doctors. They might not have a permanent living space, but they may have a city they grew up in, a place they call home.

ArkanExplorer 5y ago
Give them a bus pass and $5,000 cash, and banish them from the state. Many would take up the offer.
- aww_dang 5y ago
  https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/14/us/homeless-busing-seattle-san-francisco.html https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/14/us/homeless-busing-seattl... https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng-interactive/2017/dec/20/bussed-out-america-moves-homeless-people-country-study https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng-interactive/2017/dec/...
  - jrowley 5y ago
    Exactly. Does bussing help the individual or simply get them out of your way? Sometimes returning people to their support networks in other states can be a solution, but “banishing” doesn’t sound legal or ethical.
    - aww_dang 5y ago
      According to the article, some of the people were helped by the busing program. When they were "banished", they had entered a contract not to use homeless services in that locale. If they were not helped, were they any worse off? That question wasn't answered.
- innagadadavida 5y ago
  You could even just give them a used car and free supplies. The same amount of money per person spent in schools will do wonders for everyone and the state. Stop the government corruption.
lotsofpulp 5y ago
My parents immigrated to the US, and we moved 8 times by the time I was in 9th grade, away from friends and family (affording doctors was out of the question). Not to highly desirable places with CA coast weather, but to rural places in the south with heat and bugs, and rural places in the north with the cold. And my parents slowly moved up the ladder in each place doing whatever was in demand and had to be done to establish their footing. I think there is an interesting discussion of what is and is not owed to people, and where it is owed.
- atonse 5y ago
  I’m also an immigrant and often lament the difference in attitude between immigrants and natives in any country. But it’s not a fair comparison because immigrants as a group self select. If you had the motivation to move to a different country, often one that doesn’t speak your language, you’re naturally more driven and motivated.
  - lotsofpulp 5y ago
    Rewarding the motivated and driven and not rewarding the unmotivated and non driven seems like the ideal incentive structure for society. Obviously, easier to write than implement and execute. But my point is is there an obligation for society to not have to make people move if the economic conditions change and labor supply and demand curves move? What are the long term effects of these incentive structures?
    - luffapi 5y ago
      The government shouldn’t be in the business of “motivating” anyone (that’s propaganda). Having a social safety net so we don’t have an army of homeless people has nothing to do with “reward”, it raises the quality of living for all of us.
      - lotsofpulp 5y ago
        I am a proponent of certain social safety nets, but I am not sure the feasibility of one of them being that you can live wherever you want. We already enforce a barrier at a country’s borders, but even within a country, what would mitigate the effects everyone wanting to live in the most desirable areas? Perhaps the answer is to just keep going more dense, if one’s position is that within a country, anyone is allowed to live anywhere, either via their own means or government assistance. But I do not see that being politically popular with many, and I can envision a few feasibility concerns with that approach. Another option is that the location where you get a social safety net is not guaranteed, and so desirable land is distributed according to one’s wealth (which I know is highly dependent on one’s ancestry).

ArkanExplorer 5y ago

Give them a bus pass and $5,000 cash, and banish them from the state. Many would take up the offer.

aww_dang 5y ago
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/14/us/homeless-busing-seattle-san-francisco.html https://www.nytimes.com/2019/09/14/us/homeless-busing-seattl... https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng-interactive/2017/dec/20/bussed-out-america-moves-homeless-people-country-study https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng-interactive/2017/dec/...
- jrowley 5y ago
  Exactly. Does bussing help the individual or simply get them out of your way? Sometimes returning people to their support networks in other states can be a solution, but “banishing” doesn’t sound legal or ethical.
  - aww_dang 5y ago
    According to the article, some of the people were helped by the busing program. When they were "banished", they had entered a contract not to use homeless services in that locale. If they were not helped, were they any worse off? That question wasn't answered.
innagadadavida 5y ago
You could even just give them a used car and free supplies. The same amount of money per person spent in schools will do wonders for everyone and the state. Stop the government corruption.

lotsofpulp 5y ago

My parents immigrated to the US, and we moved 8 times by the time I was in 9th grade, away from friends and family (affording doctors was out of the question). Not to highly desirable places with CA coast weather, but to rural places in the south with heat and bugs, and rural places in the north with the cold. And my parents slowly moved up the ladder in each place doing whatever was in demand and had to be done to establish their footing. I think there is an interesting discussion of what is and is not owed to people, and where it is owed.

atonse 5y ago
I’m also an immigrant and often lament the difference in attitude between immigrants and natives in any country. But it’s not a fair comparison because immigrants as a group self select. If you had the motivation to move to a different country, often one that doesn’t speak your language, you’re naturally more driven and motivated.
- lotsofpulp 5y ago
  Rewarding the motivated and driven and not rewarding the unmotivated and non driven seems like the ideal incentive structure for society. Obviously, easier to write than implement and execute. But my point is is there an obligation for society to not have to make people move if the economic conditions change and labor supply and demand curves move? What are the long term effects of these incentive structures?
  - luffapi 5y ago
    The government shouldn’t be in the business of “motivating” anyone (that’s propaganda). Having a social safety net so we don’t have an army of homeless people has nothing to do with “reward”, it raises the quality of living for all of us.
    - lotsofpulp 5y ago
      I am a proponent of certain social safety nets, but I am not sure the feasibility of one of them being that you can live wherever you want. We already enforce a barrier at a country’s borders, but even within a country, what would mitigate the effects everyone wanting to live in the most desirable areas? Perhaps the answer is to just keep going more dense, if one’s position is that within a country, anyone is allowed to live anywhere, either via their own means or government assistance. But I do not see that being politically popular with many, and I can envision a few feasibility concerns with that approach. Another option is that the location where you get a social safety net is not guaranteed, and so desirable land is distributed according to one’s wealth (which I know is highly dependent on one’s ancestry).