3 ms·

Thats a gross generalisation. One would think, that average HNer would be a coiner because of their background.

chinathrow 5y ago
Why would I be a coiner? Bitcoin is still wasteful as fuck.
Danieru 5y ago
Nope, lots of people here are just like me: proud salty nocoiners. We poor old salty nocoiners can only wipe our flowing tears with the 100$ rags from our fat wallets. Oh poor us, we foolishly put our wealth into cashflow producing assets. Oh the sorrow every quarter as the dividends are deposited in our flash-loan-hack-proof bank accounts.
- Tenoke 5y ago
  Thats a weird thing to brag about - if talking about past returns there's few 'cash flow producing assets' that'd have done as well as just putting the money in btc. Also flash loans don't take anything out of your wallet/account either and I know of people whose bank accounts have been hacked. There's plenty to complain about btc but you've somehow chosen the least convincing argument for why you are a noncoiner.
  - Clewza313 5y ago
    Bitcoins do not produce any cash flow, the only way to profit is to sell them to a greater fool.
    - Tenoke 5y ago
      There's plenty of crypto (including e.g. ETH) that does so via staking but that wasn't the point anyway.
      - Clewza313 5y ago
        No, this was the GP's point. Many of those "salty nocoiners" are invested in assets that produce reliable cash flow, which is considerably safer than holding a purely speculative asset like crypto.
        deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
  - NicoJuicy 5y ago
    Victims of bank fraud mostly receive their money back by the bank. This one recent example of an crypto exchange that fled with the money, has defrauded more in value than the entire ACH payment system worth ~51T ( fraud = 0,0008 % = 0,08 basis points). https://www.engadget.com/africrypt-bitcoin-disappearance-174636634.html https://www.engadget.com/africrypt-bitcoin-disappearance-174... https://silamoney.com/ach/understanding-the-basics-of-ach-fraud/ https://silamoney.com/ach/understanding-the-basics-of-ach-fr...
    - Tenoke 5y ago
      That's not a hack that's a scam.
      - NicoJuicy 5y ago
        Both are labeled as fraud.
- NicoJuicy 5y ago
  That's not completely true. I left it at ~18 k. A couple of years ago as i didn't saw a path to become profitable. I suppose a lot of HN'ers joined early on and left by now. My stocks are doing good enough for me to not care at all about crypto since then. Even if that wouldn't be the case, I wouldn't invest in something that I don't think has a viable path. Eg. The current solutions are using off-chain centralized transactions to fix core things ( eg. transaction fee).
celticninja 5y ago
What happens is that many on HN were around in 2009-2011 when it first appeared and was cheap. Everyone who didn't buy in then has a vested interest in it failing because then they feel like they didn't miss out and that their decision not to get involved was validated. It is becoming apparent as time goes by that there are very many of them here. I seem to have attracted some that downvote every comment I make.
- southerntofu 5y ago
  I owned Bitcoin back in 2012-2014 when i thought it was going to be an actual currency to exchange goods and services. Since then, it has become a tool for speculation and an ecological disaster, both of which are strongly opposed to my ethos. I now own precisely 0€ worth of Bitcoin and strongly recommend all my friends never to fall into that kind of trap. Because capitalism and speculation ruins lives, whether you trade stocks or magic BTC numbers. I'm not alone: https://drewdevault.com/2021/04/26/Cryptocurrency-is-a-disaster.html https://drewdevault.com/2021/04/26/Cryptocurrency-is-a-disas...
  - celticninja 5y ago
    >capitalism and speculation ruin lives And yet here you are on hackernews, owned and run by ycombinator, an organisation that exists to capitalise on both of these things, with the aim of making a small group of investors and founders very very rich. https://www.ycombinator.com/topcompanies/ https://www.ycombinator.com/topcompanies/ Are you aware of the cognitive dissonance in your position?
    - southerntofu 5y ago
      > Are you aware of the cognitive dissonance in your position? I am more than aware of my position and my surroundings. But i don't feel any dissonance, though i do feel a lot of ethical/ideological conflict in these forums (which i'm happy to take part in on occasion).
    - celticninja 5y ago
      For reference I also got involved in a similar period and used it successfully to transact business with people in foreign countries at a much lower cost than via bank transactions. Yes bitcoin has pivoted now to a store of wealth or even a cheap way to move large sums and it is less efficient for smaller transactions, but lightning network solves this problem sufficiently. Again pivoting is not something unique to bitcoin and many tech firms have pivoted to find their niche. Being able to react and respond is a feature not a bug.
lowkey 5y ago
It may be a gross generalization but based on the majority of comments on HN, it is unfortunately an accurate one. Not only are the comments salty, they are generally ill-informed. See Dang’s recent call to HN for more insightful comments and less vitriol for example. It hurts me to say this about HN because on other topics comments are often deeply insightful but when it comes to Bitcoin (and other cryptos) HN comments are often ignorant and dismissive.

Why would I be a coiner? Bitcoin is still wasteful as fuck.

Nope, lots of people here are just like me: proud salty nocoiners. We poor old salty nocoiners can only wipe our flowing tears with the 100$ rags from our fat wallets. Oh poor us, we foolishly put our wealth into cashflow producing assets. Oh the sorrow every quarter as the dividends are deposited in our flash-loan-hack-proof bank accounts.

Tenoke 5y ago
Thats a weird thing to brag about - if talking about past returns there's few 'cash flow producing assets' that'd have done as well as just putting the money in btc. Also flash loans don't take anything out of your wallet/account either and I know of people whose bank accounts have been hacked. There's plenty to complain about btc but you've somehow chosen the least convincing argument for why you are a noncoiner.
- Clewza313 5y ago
  Bitcoins do not produce any cash flow, the only way to profit is to sell them to a greater fool.
  - Tenoke 5y ago
    There's plenty of crypto (including e.g. ETH) that does so via staking but that wasn't the point anyway.
    - Clewza313 5y ago
      No, this was the GP's point. Many of those "salty nocoiners" are invested in assets that produce reliable cash flow, which is considerably safer than holding a purely speculative asset like crypto.
      - deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
- NicoJuicy 5y ago
  Victims of bank fraud mostly receive their money back by the bank. This one recent example of an crypto exchange that fled with the money, has defrauded more in value than the entire ACH payment system worth ~51T ( fraud = 0,0008 % = 0,08 basis points). https://www.engadget.com/africrypt-bitcoin-disappearance-174636634.html https://www.engadget.com/africrypt-bitcoin-disappearance-174... https://silamoney.com/ach/understanding-the-basics-of-ach-fraud/ https://silamoney.com/ach/understanding-the-basics-of-ach-fr...
  - Tenoke 5y ago
    That's not a hack that's a scam.
    - NicoJuicy 5y ago
      Both are labeled as fraud.
NicoJuicy 5y ago
That's not completely true. I left it at ~18 k. A couple of years ago as i didn't saw a path to become profitable. I suppose a lot of HN'ers joined early on and left by now. My stocks are doing good enough for me to not care at all about crypto since then. Even if that wouldn't be the case, I wouldn't invest in something that I don't think has a viable path. Eg. The current solutions are using off-chain centralized transactions to fix core things ( eg. transaction fee).

celticninja 5y ago

What happens is that many on HN were around in 2009-2011 when it first appeared and was cheap. Everyone who didn't buy in then has a vested interest in it failing because then they feel like they didn't miss out and that their decision not to get involved was validated. It is becoming apparent as time goes by that there are very many of them here. I seem to have attracted some that downvote every comment I make.

southerntofu 5y ago
I owned Bitcoin back in 2012-2014 when i thought it was going to be an actual currency to exchange goods and services. Since then, it has become a tool for speculation and an ecological disaster, both of which are strongly opposed to my ethos. I now own precisely 0€ worth of Bitcoin and strongly recommend all my friends never to fall into that kind of trap. Because capitalism and speculation ruins lives, whether you trade stocks or magic BTC numbers. I'm not alone: https://drewdevault.com/2021/04/26/Cryptocurrency-is-a-disaster.html https://drewdevault.com/2021/04/26/Cryptocurrency-is-a-disas...
- celticninja 5y ago
  >capitalism and speculation ruin lives And yet here you are on hackernews, owned and run by ycombinator, an organisation that exists to capitalise on both of these things, with the aim of making a small group of investors and founders very very rich. https://www.ycombinator.com/topcompanies/ https://www.ycombinator.com/topcompanies/ Are you aware of the cognitive dissonance in your position?
  - southerntofu 5y ago
    > Are you aware of the cognitive dissonance in your position? I am more than aware of my position and my surroundings. But i don't feel any dissonance, though i do feel a lot of ethical/ideological conflict in these forums (which i'm happy to take part in on occasion).
  - celticninja 5y ago
    For reference I also got involved in a similar period and used it successfully to transact business with people in foreign countries at a much lower cost than via bank transactions. Yes bitcoin has pivoted now to a store of wealth or even a cheap way to move large sums and it is less efficient for smaller transactions, but lightning network solves this problem sufficiently. Again pivoting is not something unique to bitcoin and many tech firms have pivoted to find their niche. Being able to react and respond is a feature not a bug.

lowkey 5y ago

It may be a gross generalization but based on the majority of comments on HN, it is unfortunately an accurate one. Not only are the comments salty, they are generally ill-informed. See Dang’s recent call to HN for more insightful comments and less vitriol for example. It hurts me to say this about HN because on other topics comments are often deeply insightful but when it comes to Bitcoin (and other cryptos) HN comments are often ignorant and dismissive.