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The cited BLS distinguishes between "Software Developers" and "Computer Programmers". It says Software Developer employment will increase by 22% over the next 1

The cited BLS distinguishes between "Software Developers" and "Computer Programmers". It says Software Developer employment will increase by 22% over the next 10 years, while Computer Programmers will decline by 9%. https://www.bls.gov/ooh/computer-and-information-technology/home.htm https://www.bls.gov/ooh/computer-and-information-technology/... I have always been a bit perplexed by the distinction. What are examples of "Computer Programmer" jobs in the US? Why would you want two distinct classes of "software creators"?

blihp 5y ago
I generally think of a 'developer' as someone who can deal with more of the software development process (i.e. identify the requirements, break down the problem, define the tasks, perform the tasks) while a 'programmer' is someone you hand off defined tasks to be implemented. YMMV as everyone seems to have their own definition.
shagie 5y ago
This has to do with the history of the classification. At one point, there was Application Developer and System Developer as two classifications. There was also a distinction at one time between what amounted to "people who wrote code" and "people who designed software". The writing code was the 'lower' of the two and the 'design' description included overseeing the other classification. You can see this by poking at the Wayback for this page: * 2012 - Programmers & Developers ( http://web.archive.org/web/20120416044322/https://www.bls.gov/ooh/computer-and-information-technology/home.htm http://web.archive.org/web/20120416044322/https://www.bls.go... ) (and a catch all "Web Developers" with a bunch of other stuff - maybe a holdover from the webmaster?) * 2014 - Programmers & Developers & Web Developers ( http://web.archive.org/web/20140627205116/http://www.bls.gov/ooh/computer-and-information-technology/home.htm http://web.archive.org/web/20140627205116/http://www.bls.gov... ) * 2021 - Programmers, Developers, & Web Developers and Digital Designers - http://web.archive.org/web/20210331093730/https://www.bls.gov/ooh/computer-and-information-technology/home.htm http://web.archive.org/web/20210331093730/https://www.bls.go... ---- Another way of looking at this is https://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes_stru.htm#15-0000 https://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes_stru.htm#15-0000 and the history of that page (which goes back even further). Back in '07 ( http://web.archive.org/web/20070111041207/https://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes_stru.htm http://web.archive.org/web/20070111041207/https://www.bls.go... ), there were Computer Programmers; Computer Software Engineers, Applications; and Computer Software Engineers, Systems Software. So, it really is a change of "this is how businesses and government see the "Computer and Mathematical Science Occupations". Lumping it all together isn't necessarily the right answer. The titles that we've got that don't actually map to what we do doesn't help.
- emddudley 5y ago
  Ah, it's interesting to see how it has changed over time! Thanks for doing some digging.
11thEarlOfMar 5y ago
Guessing a bit, but Software Developer is probably the new Computer Programmer. It may just be a shift in terminology by human resources departments and the net change in jobs for 'people who design and write software programs' is somewhat less than 22%.
unbearded 5y ago
In my experience, there's the "software developer" and the "formware developer," and as more companies go through a real "Digital Transformation," they begin to require their programmers to do more advanced tasks that go beyond form-based CRUD applications.

blihp 5y ago

I generally think of a 'developer' as someone who can deal with more of the software development process (i.e. identify the requirements, break down the problem, define the tasks, perform the tasks) while a 'programmer' is someone you hand off defined tasks to be implemented. YMMV as everyone seems to have their own definition.

shagie 5y ago

This has to do with the history of the classification. At one point, there was Application Developer and System Developer as two classifications. There was also a distinction at one time between what amounted to "people who wrote code" and "people who designed software". The writing code was the 'lower' of the two and the 'design' description included overseeing the other classification. You can see this by poking at the Wayback for this page: * 2012 - Programmers & Developers ( http://web.archive.org/web/20120416044322/https://www.bls.gov/ooh/computer-and-information-technology/home.htm http://web.archive.org/web/20120416044322/https://www.bls.go... ) (and a catch all "Web Developers" with a bunch of other stuff - maybe a holdover from the webmaster?) * 2014 - Programmers & Developers & Web Developers ( http://web.archive.org/web/20140627205116/http://www.bls.gov/ooh/computer-and-information-technology/home.htm http://web.archive.org/web/20140627205116/http://www.bls.gov... ) * 2021 - Programmers, Developers, & Web Developers and Digital Designers - http://web.archive.org/web/20210331093730/https://www.bls.gov/ooh/computer-and-information-technology/home.htm http://web.archive.org/web/20210331093730/https://www.bls.go... ---- Another way of looking at this is https://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes_stru.htm#15-0000 https://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes_stru.htm#15-0000 and the history of that page (which goes back even further). Back in '07 ( http://web.archive.org/web/20070111041207/https://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes_stru.htm http://web.archive.org/web/20070111041207/https://www.bls.go... ), there were Computer Programmers; Computer Software Engineers, Applications; and Computer Software Engineers, Systems Software. So, it really is a change of "this is how businesses and government see the "Computer and Mathematical Science Occupations". Lumping it all together isn't necessarily the right answer. The titles that we've got that don't actually map to what we do doesn't help.

emddudley 5y ago
Ah, it's interesting to see how it has changed over time! Thanks for doing some digging.

11thEarlOfMar 5y ago

Guessing a bit, but Software Developer is probably the new Computer Programmer. It may just be a shift in terminology by human resources departments and the net change in jobs for 'people who design and write software programs' is somewhat less than 22%.

unbearded 5y ago

In my experience, there's the "software developer" and the "formware developer," and as more companies go through a real "Digital Transformation," they begin to require their programmers to do more advanced tasks that go beyond form-based CRUD applications.