4 ms·

Bravo. This is the natural product of a culture that paradoxically wants to be sex positive for women but also sex negative for men. The outcomes are surprising

Bravo. This is the natural product of a culture that paradoxically wants to be sex positive for women but also sex negative for men. The outcomes are surprisingly similar to what happens to a culture that's sex negative for women and sex positive for men.

wonderwonder 5y ago
I wonder how much day to day violence would be reduced if prostitution was normalized. How much violence is a result of internalized sexual frustration without an outlet.
- Y-Bopinator 5y ago
  Implying you can't just masturbate and need to use women like a toilet
- eloff 5y ago
  I would hazard a guess that it wouldn't improve. The kinds of people involved in violence are overwhelmingly poor, young males. This is not a group that cares about laws or cultural norms. They lack the money to pay for sex workers, they don't have cultural hangups about it. They lack the money, education, and human decency to maintain a girlfriend relationship. Which is to say they're not bad people because they're sexually frustrated. They're sexually frustrated because they're bad people. Which can be a negative feedback cycle.
  - snakeboy 5y ago
    How about those at the margin? I'd guess most policy proposals don't seem productive when you condense a population down to a scalar "model" subject and ask if he would change his behavior in light of the new policy. That doesn't mean that population-level effects won't be observed.
    - eloff 5y ago
      I'm going to guess the effect would be marginal :) If you want to address violence it would be better to focus on reducing poverty, on education, and on rehabilitation. A lot of violence is drug related, providing a legal market for buying and selling illegal drugs would kill that element crime. Prohibition of drugs seems to be playing out the same that prohibition of alcohol did. Those who do not know their history are doomed to repeat it. Normalizing prostitution is not likely to move the needle for the reasons I mentioned.
- emsy 5y ago
  I can’t reply to eloff directly but you are wrong, which is why we should base law on hard numbers and not „guesses“.
  - username90 5y ago
    If prostitution has to be done at places with security guards it wouldn't be a big issue though, she just screams and the guy gets thrown out and possibly charged/arrested.
    - bayesian_horse 5y ago
      Screaming might not be enough...
      - username90 5y ago
        For a security guard sitting in the corridor outside to hear you? Definitely it would.
- bayesian_horse 5y ago
  That is a BS argument. Sexual frustration is the norm, rather than the exception, and if somebody commits a rape to act out sexual desires, then it is not because he didn't have access to prostitutes. I doubt there are a lot of people who frequent prostitutes as much as most couples have sex in a relationship... However, honestly "voluntary" prostitution is also too expensive. Which is a big reason for the famed "management level" to exist. Through drugs, physical and psychological abuse they create a much cheaper supply, and only that way the demand can be met.
  - JumpCrisscross 5y ago
    > if somebody commits a rape to act out sexual desires, then it is not because he didn't have access to prostitutes I'd argue this is precisely the person who should not have access to prostitutes. Their existence, or our inability to adequately police them, is one of the stronger arguments against prostitution.
- wruza 5y ago
  internalized sexual frustration without an outlet Unless we’re talking about hi-class hi-paid workers here, which are far from common, this “outlet” has the same (or even lower) voltage than your hand-y discharger, if you get the analogy. The more realistic result will be you and your kids living amidst endless brothels and their frustrated clients.
- watwut 5y ago
  Plenty of violence is commited by men who have sexual partners. Also, violent men do commit violence againta their sexual partners.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
Flow 5y ago
In Sweden there are plenty of "yoni dearmouring" and similar sevices. I get that more women have a harder time orgasming than men usually have. Also more trauma amongst women than men. But if you are a man with these kinds of problems you have nowhere to go.

wonderwonder 5y ago

I wonder how much day to day violence would be reduced if prostitution was normalized. How much violence is a result of internalized sexual frustration without an outlet.

Y-Bopinator 5y ago
Implying you can't just masturbate and need to use women like a toilet
eloff 5y ago
I would hazard a guess that it wouldn't improve. The kinds of people involved in violence are overwhelmingly poor, young males. This is not a group that cares about laws or cultural norms. They lack the money to pay for sex workers, they don't have cultural hangups about it. They lack the money, education, and human decency to maintain a girlfriend relationship. Which is to say they're not bad people because they're sexually frustrated. They're sexually frustrated because they're bad people. Which can be a negative feedback cycle.
- snakeboy 5y ago
  How about those at the margin? I'd guess most policy proposals don't seem productive when you condense a population down to a scalar "model" subject and ask if he would change his behavior in light of the new policy. That doesn't mean that population-level effects won't be observed.
  - eloff 5y ago
    I'm going to guess the effect would be marginal :) If you want to address violence it would be better to focus on reducing poverty, on education, and on rehabilitation. A lot of violence is drug related, providing a legal market for buying and selling illegal drugs would kill that element crime. Prohibition of drugs seems to be playing out the same that prohibition of alcohol did. Those who do not know their history are doomed to repeat it. Normalizing prostitution is not likely to move the needle for the reasons I mentioned.
emsy 5y ago
I can’t reply to eloff directly but you are wrong, which is why we should base law on hard numbers and not „guesses“.
- username90 5y ago
  If prostitution has to be done at places with security guards it wouldn't be a big issue though, she just screams and the guy gets thrown out and possibly charged/arrested.
  - bayesian_horse 5y ago
    Screaming might not be enough...
    - username90 5y ago
      For a security guard sitting in the corridor outside to hear you? Definitely it would.
bayesian_horse 5y ago
That is a BS argument. Sexual frustration is the norm, rather than the exception, and if somebody commits a rape to act out sexual desires, then it is not because he didn't have access to prostitutes. I doubt there are a lot of people who frequent prostitutes as much as most couples have sex in a relationship... However, honestly "voluntary" prostitution is also too expensive. Which is a big reason for the famed "management level" to exist. Through drugs, physical and psychological abuse they create a much cheaper supply, and only that way the demand can be met.
- JumpCrisscross 5y ago
  > if somebody commits a rape to act out sexual desires, then it is not because he didn't have access to prostitutes I'd argue this is precisely the person who should not have access to prostitutes. Their existence, or our inability to adequately police them, is one of the stronger arguments against prostitution.
wruza 5y ago
internalized sexual frustration without an outlet Unless we’re talking about hi-class hi-paid workers here, which are far from common, this “outlet” has the same (or even lower) voltage than your hand-y discharger, if you get the analogy. The more realistic result will be you and your kids living amidst endless brothels and their frustrated clients.
watwut 5y ago
Plenty of violence is commited by men who have sexual partners. Also, violent men do commit violence againta their sexual partners.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

Flow 5y ago

In Sweden there are plenty of "yoni dearmouring" and similar sevices. I get that more women have a harder time orgasming than men usually have. Also more trauma amongst women than men. But if you are a man with these kinds of problems you have nowhere to go.