4 ms·

Let's see how this union competes with Amazon's robot workers.

by slver 5y ago

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
Klinky 5y ago
Everyone should welcome automation and reduced working hours, but our system prioritizes underpaid labor so much, that automation is often significantly more expensive. Low labor wages and poor safety nets hinders progress on automation, and it's wheeled out as a threat and bogeyman to scare the poors back into line. Let the robots come in and do this labor, but that doesn't excuse society's responsibility to take care of its humans.
- slver 5y ago
  The point here is if unions come in and start having unreasonable demands, this expensive automation you're talking about becomes comparatively affordable. Society should take care of its humans, but this doesn't mean go into private companies and demand all the box movers get their pay tripled. It doesn't work this way.
  - Klinky 5y ago
    >expensive automation you're talking about becomes comparatively affordable Perfect! Isn't that the point? Automation to make our lives easier? More automation will lead to commoditization of robots, instead of the current commoditization and dehumanization of humans. Again your mindset shows you want to use automation as a threat against humanity to keep human cattle in line, and not as a force for good. >It doesn't work this way. Why not? Right now society is failing to take care of a large number of humans in order to maintain status quos that greatly enrich the few.
    - slver 5y ago
      > Perfect! Isn't that the point? Automation to make our lives easier? More automation will lead to commoditization of robots, instead of the current commoditization and dehumanization of humans. > Again your mindset shows you want to use automation as a threat against humanity to keep human cattle in line, and not as a force for good. Look, you're trying very hard to put me in some narrative that solely exists in your head, not mine. Automation is not a "threat". It's happening, but it needs a push. And unions are here to provide that push. You think that millions of unemployable workers is somehow less "dehumanizing" than having a job that matches their skillset. Bizarre. Regarding the Star Wars categories of what's a force for evil and what's a force for good, I'll stay out of that, because those are stories for children. Economics is about incentives and alignment of interests.
      - Klinky 5y ago
        >Automation is not a "threat". It's happening, but it needs a push. And unions are here to provide that push. Again, you are positioning automation as a threat, and portraying unions as a bad thing, which will push people out of jobs, they will then become homeless, starve and die. That's the best society can offer? >You think that millions of unemployable workers is somehow less "dehumanizing" than having a job that matches their skillset. Bizarre. You've already dehumanized these workers and written them off as having no other skillset potential. You cannot think of an economy that could work without suppressing automation and grinding people's lives away with manual labor? >Regarding the Star Wars categories of what's a force for evil and what's a force for good, I'll stay out of that, because those are stories for children. No, you've made your feelings clear that "unions are a force for evil" and threats of automation are needed to nip that in the bud. We should incentivize automation, and look into ways to invest in improving the human experience, instead of writing people off as being incapable of achieving greater things. >Economics is about incentives and alignment of interests. This is so basic, it has practically no application in reality. You need to define what is being incentivized and who's interests are being catered to in the actual economy. Right now dehumanizing behavior and externalizing costs onto society is heavily incentivized, and I would strongly dispute there is an alignment of interests occurring.

Let's see how this union competes with Amazon's robot workers.

by slver 5y ago

Let's see how this union competes with Amazon's robot workers.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

Klinky 5y ago

Everyone should welcome automation and reduced working hours, but our system prioritizes underpaid labor so much, that automation is often significantly more expensive. Low labor wages and poor safety nets hinders progress on automation, and it's wheeled out as a threat and bogeyman to scare the poors back into line. Let the robots come in and do this labor, but that doesn't excuse society's responsibility to take care of its humans.

slver 5y ago
The point here is if unions come in and start having unreasonable demands, this expensive automation you're talking about becomes comparatively affordable. Society should take care of its humans, but this doesn't mean go into private companies and demand all the box movers get their pay tripled. It doesn't work this way.
- Klinky 5y ago
  >expensive automation you're talking about becomes comparatively affordable Perfect! Isn't that the point? Automation to make our lives easier? More automation will lead to commoditization of robots, instead of the current commoditization and dehumanization of humans. Again your mindset shows you want to use automation as a threat against humanity to keep human cattle in line, and not as a force for good. >It doesn't work this way. Why not? Right now society is failing to take care of a large number of humans in order to maintain status quos that greatly enrich the few.
  - slver 5y ago
    > Perfect! Isn't that the point? Automation to make our lives easier? More automation will lead to commoditization of robots, instead of the current commoditization and dehumanization of humans. > Again your mindset shows you want to use automation as a threat against humanity to keep human cattle in line, and not as a force for good. Look, you're trying very hard to put me in some narrative that solely exists in your head, not mine. Automation is not a "threat". It's happening, but it needs a push. And unions are here to provide that push. You think that millions of unemployable workers is somehow less "dehumanizing" than having a job that matches their skillset. Bizarre. Regarding the Star Wars categories of what's a force for evil and what's a force for good, I'll stay out of that, because those are stories for children. Economics is about incentives and alignment of interests.
    - Klinky 5y ago
      >Automation is not a "threat". It's happening, but it needs a push. And unions are here to provide that push. Again, you are positioning automation as a threat, and portraying unions as a bad thing, which will push people out of jobs, they will then become homeless, starve and die. That's the best society can offer? >You think that millions of unemployable workers is somehow less "dehumanizing" than having a job that matches their skillset. Bizarre. You've already dehumanized these workers and written them off as having no other skillset potential. You cannot think of an economy that could work without suppressing automation and grinding people's lives away with manual labor? >Regarding the Star Wars categories of what's a force for evil and what's a force for good, I'll stay out of that, because those are stories for children. No, you've made your feelings clear that "unions are a force for evil" and threats of automation are needed to nip that in the bud. We should incentivize automation, and look into ways to invest in improving the human experience, instead of writing people off as being incapable of achieving greater things. >Economics is about incentives and alignment of interests. This is so basic, it has practically no application in reality. You need to define what is being incentivized and who's interests are being catered to in the actual economy. Right now dehumanizing behavior and externalizing costs onto society is heavily incentivized, and I would strongly dispute there is an alignment of interests occurring.