5 ms·

In skiing, only a few individuals at the very top make any real money. Most "professional skiers" just get free gear and travel budgets to film a segment or go

by cjonas 5y ago

In skiing, only a few individuals at the very top make any real money. Most "professional skiers" just get free gear and travel budgets to film a segment or go to competitions. To be a professional, you either have to be a massive dirtbag, or have a trust fund; and the former has gotten much harder these days. Same deal for professional climbers, AFIAK. I also disagree in that climbing seems quite affordable compared to other outdoor recreation. Shoes and ropes are the biggest wearable expenses (the latter of which you can split with your partner). You can even get a trad rack for ~500$ that will last you a decade (minus replacing a stuck piece occasionally). Most importantly, climbing outside is free. When I walk out of my house to go skiing, I probably have close to 7k in gear on me, all of which has to be replaced every 2-5 seasons :(

pcthrowaway 5y ago
Sponsored climbers are quite common. Climbers who would have no chance of winning a competition and are climbing nowhere near the frontier of the sport can become sponsored; it's often about building connections and a name for themselves (perhaps for being really good at one specific move, or doing some first ascents in a remote area). I think very few climbers have made $1 million in a year from sponsorships. But if I had to guess, I'd say Alex Honnold and Lynn Hill have (and perhaps a handful of a few others). Sure, it's probably not $1mm every year, but I'd be surprised if they're not making that some years. Right now, the climbing "industry" is also going through a massive boom which has led to hundreds of new gear companies, so this might be the most lucrative time ever to be a sponsored rock climber. And yes, it's not the most expensive sport either, I already acknowledged skiing is likely more expensive. As someone who climbs outside 30-50 times a year I personally would need to spend ~$400/year just to keep up with replacing helmets, harnesses, ropes, slings, shoes, and misc. lost/broken/damaged gear. It's more because I'm adding to my trad rack constantly, but I know lots of climbers who spend roughly this amount every year, none of whom climb competitively or professionally. And you can get a trad rack for $500 (in the U.S.), but that would just be single cams from .3-3 with carabiners, a nut tool, and a handful of slings and nuts. And you'd still have to buy it used. Add in quickdraws, double cams, more nuts, and other gear (guidebooks, bouldering pads, totems, offsets, hexes, tricams, UFOs, aiders, big bros, portledges, pulleys, ascenders, haul bags), and as a non-professional climber, it can be very easy to spend >$1000/year. Compare this with a soccer player who plays a couple of pickup games every week. Even if soccer is a much more popular sport for people to play/watch, it's easy to imagine how the same amount of money could be spent on climbing gear collectively.
- jasonkester 5y ago
  It still sounds like you’re stretching a bit to make the sport sound expensive. Sure, a trad rack might set you back a couple thousand dollars, but nobody buys the whole thing at once. You’ll build your rack slowly over a dozen years, maybe tricking in a new cam or two and the odd nut to replace stuff you’ve lost. But nobody ever retires cams, and no dirtbag climber has ever decided to spontaneously replace his entire trad rack. Similarly, as a sport climber, I get a new rope every six or eight years if I’m trashing it, and a new rack of draws every fifteen. It’s not a regular occurrence. I moved to Fontainebleau specifically for bouldering and am on the rocks 3 days a week. I go through 2 pairs of shoes a year and add a pad to the collection every few years. If I spend $500 on the sport in a year, that’s a big year. Compare that to something like surfing, where I’ll spend more than that on baggage fees for one trip, and it just rounds to zero on the scale of expensive sports.
  - pcthrowaway 5y ago
    It certainly can be done much cheaper, and bouldering alone is about as cheap as it gets. I live near Squamish and it's known for multi pitch climbing. People who just climb sport spend ~$400/year replacing gear. It's probably not the same everywhere, but lots of long climbs and rappels will wear at your rope. Even faster if you're taking falls on it. I know people who have only ever bought one rope, but they don't climb very much. Personally I've been climbing outdoors for almost 3 years now and have had to buy a rope every year (2 ropes one year actually). I realize I'm not 'typical' of a climber, but I've probably spent $9000 USD total on equipment in the time frame. Mostly new equipment, but also mostly on sale 20-30% off retail price. But even the 'dirtbags' I know may save money by not paying rent, hitchhiking, living in vans, or camping, and still can spend $400-600 a year on climbing equipment
  - jessaustin 5y ago
    I agree with you on the the accessibility of climbing, but "moving to Fontainebleau" doesn't sound cheap! b^)
    - jasonkester 5y ago
spoonjim 5y ago
What is a "dirtbag" in this context?
- dagw 5y ago
  A "dirtbag" in climbing/skiing circles is someone who lives in a beat up van, has very little money and spends all their time and (meager) money driving for spot to spot, devoting their entire life to climbing/skiing.
  - Fricken 5y ago
    There are dirtbag surfers as well. They only get so dirty because they're always in the ocean.
  - spoonjim 5y ago
    Ah thanks. No “scumbag” implications? Because not traveling in outdoor circles I think of “dirtbag” as a guy who sleeps with teenage girls and sells stolen property out of a van.

by cjonas 5y ago

pcthrowaway 5y ago

Sponsored climbers are quite common. Climbers who would have no chance of winning a competition and are climbing nowhere near the frontier of the sport can become sponsored; it's often about building connections and a name for themselves (perhaps for being really good at one specific move, or doing some first ascents in a remote area). I think very few climbers have made $1 million in a year from sponsorships. But if I had to guess, I'd say Alex Honnold and Lynn Hill have (and perhaps a handful of a few others). Sure, it's probably not $1mm every year, but I'd be surprised if they're not making that some years. Right now, the climbing "industry" is also going through a massive boom which has led to hundreds of new gear companies, so this might be the most lucrative time ever to be a sponsored rock climber. And yes, it's not the most expensive sport either, I already acknowledged skiing is likely more expensive. As someone who climbs outside 30-50 times a year I personally would need to spend ~$400/year just to keep up with replacing helmets, harnesses, ropes, slings, shoes, and misc. lost/broken/damaged gear. It's more because I'm adding to my trad rack constantly, but I know lots of climbers who spend roughly this amount every year, none of whom climb competitively or professionally. And you can get a trad rack for $500 (in the U.S.), but that would just be single cams from .3-3 with carabiners, a nut tool, and a handful of slings and nuts. And you'd still have to buy it used. Add in quickdraws, double cams, more nuts, and other gear (guidebooks, bouldering pads, totems, offsets, hexes, tricams, UFOs, aiders, big bros, portledges, pulleys, ascenders, haul bags), and as a non-professional climber, it can be very easy to spend >$1000/year. Compare this with a soccer player who plays a couple of pickup games every week. Even if soccer is a much more popular sport for people to play/watch, it's easy to imagine how the same amount of money could be spent on climbing gear collectively.

jasonkester 5y ago
It still sounds like you’re stretching a bit to make the sport sound expensive. Sure, a trad rack might set you back a couple thousand dollars, but nobody buys the whole thing at once. You’ll build your rack slowly over a dozen years, maybe tricking in a new cam or two and the odd nut to replace stuff you’ve lost. But nobody ever retires cams, and no dirtbag climber has ever decided to spontaneously replace his entire trad rack. Similarly, as a sport climber, I get a new rope every six or eight years if I’m trashing it, and a new rack of draws every fifteen. It’s not a regular occurrence. I moved to Fontainebleau specifically for bouldering and am on the rocks 3 days a week. I go through 2 pairs of shoes a year and add a pad to the collection every few years. If I spend $500 on the sport in a year, that’s a big year. Compare that to something like surfing, where I’ll spend more than that on baggage fees for one trip, and it just rounds to zero on the scale of expensive sports.
- pcthrowaway 5y ago
  It certainly can be done much cheaper, and bouldering alone is about as cheap as it gets. I live near Squamish and it's known for multi pitch climbing. People who just climb sport spend ~$400/year replacing gear. It's probably not the same everywhere, but lots of long climbs and rappels will wear at your rope. Even faster if you're taking falls on it. I know people who have only ever bought one rope, but they don't climb very much. Personally I've been climbing outdoors for almost 3 years now and have had to buy a rope every year (2 ropes one year actually). I realize I'm not 'typical' of a climber, but I've probably spent $9000 USD total on equipment in the time frame. Mostly new equipment, but also mostly on sale 20-30% off retail price. But even the 'dirtbags' I know may save money by not paying rent, hitchhiking, living in vans, or camping, and still can spend $400-600 a year on climbing equipment
- jessaustin 5y ago
  I agree with you on the the accessibility of climbing, but "moving to Fontainebleau" doesn't sound cheap! b^)
  - jasonkester 5y ago

spoonjim 5y ago

What is a "dirtbag" in this context?

dagw 5y ago
A "dirtbag" in climbing/skiing circles is someone who lives in a beat up van, has very little money and spends all their time and (meager) money driving for spot to spot, devoting their entire life to climbing/skiing.
- Fricken 5y ago
  There are dirtbag surfers as well. They only get so dirty because they're always in the ocean.
- spoonjim 5y ago
  Ah thanks. No “scumbag” implications? Because not traveling in outdoor circles I think of “dirtbag” as a guy who sleeps with teenage girls and sells stolen property out of a van.