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The reason you wouldn’t work elsewhere and invest is the following: you get hired at Amazon with a total comp of 500k (180 base + 320k in RSUs). You have been i

The reason you wouldn’t work elsewhere and invest is the following: you get hired at Amazon with a total comp of 500k (180 base + 320k in RSUs). You have been in role for 2 years and are completely burnt out. However the stock has doubled, and your total comp (without any raises) is now 820k. That is too much money for people to walk away from. If you leave for GOOG you will get in at the current stock price with no guarantee it will double effectively taking a pay cut.

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
htrp 5y ago
You're also on a 4 year 5/15/40/40 vest
- rejectedandsad 5y ago
  That’s irrelevant they give you the same amount in “signing bonus” with a 55/45/0/0 “vest”.
  - sokoloff 5y ago
    But you’re vesting 40% of your initial grant this year was the point, not that you didn’t get the initial “fill in” cash bonus.
    - rejectedandsad 5y ago
      Fair but if you decide to invest in Amazon with the proceeds you’re in the same boat. And other companies do frequently at least attempt to match scenarios like this (if you’re smart enough to get better offers).
  - dlp211 5y ago
    Except that their competitors are giving you 25/25/25/25 vest with 100/0/0/0 signing bonus.
    - rejectedandsad 5y ago
      True, there isn’t a real concept of a bonus of any kind* at Amazon. They definitely lean on the stick more than the carrot.
renewiltord 5y ago
That makes sense. I wasn't sure if SDEs get x units or y dollars worth of stock units each year. The former is most common, but everything about AMZN is unusual, including the vest schedule.
- TFortunato 5y ago
  Amazon does it in dollars. Employees have a target comp figure in dollars, the annual stock refreshers are based on the price of the stock at that time, so if you got 100 units one year, and the stock doubles, all things being equal, you would only get 50 units the next year at refresh time. In practice this means you can make good money off your hiring grant if price keeps going up, but you will also see your total comp hit a cliff / drop after a few years, since while stock going up is usually good, in Amazon's eyes, you've been lucky to be making more than your target comp those years and they aren't going to keep giving you the same amount of units if those units are worth more.
thanhhaimai 5y ago
That logic applies when you joined a while ago. However, with the stock sky high (P/E 66, double GOOG 33), joining Amazon right now may not give you that potential upside anymore. Your managers and long time careers will get a larger portion of the upside. It's already evident by the stock growth of GOOG compared to AMZN in the past one year/quarter. The P/E of Amazon is high, compared with the growth potential vs others in FAANG. Picking a company to join is also akin to pick a stock to invest. Low P/E is not everything, but it's an important part of the equation. For non-Staff level SWEs, my opinion is that joining a FAANG with lower P/E is better for your future earnings.
- testing_1_2_3_4 5y ago
  Amazon's PE has always been this high
  - state_less 5y ago
    But their market cap hasn’t. Odds are they won’t 5x their size in the next five years as they did in their last five.
    - bin_bash 5y ago
      That's what people said 5 years ago.
      - WJW 5y ago
        Eventually they'll start being right. Not even Amazon can grow at this pace forever.
    - 55555 5y ago
      Their retail business is still in a tiny portion of the world.
      - testing_1_2_3_4 5y ago

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htrp 5y ago

You're also on a 4 year 5/15/40/40 vest

rejectedandsad 5y ago
That’s irrelevant they give you the same amount in “signing bonus” with a 55/45/0/0 “vest”.
- sokoloff 5y ago
  But you’re vesting 40% of your initial grant this year was the point, not that you didn’t get the initial “fill in” cash bonus.
  - rejectedandsad 5y ago
    Fair but if you decide to invest in Amazon with the proceeds you’re in the same boat. And other companies do frequently at least attempt to match scenarios like this (if you’re smart enough to get better offers).
- dlp211 5y ago
  Except that their competitors are giving you 25/25/25/25 vest with 100/0/0/0 signing bonus.
  - rejectedandsad 5y ago
    True, there isn’t a real concept of a bonus of any kind* at Amazon. They definitely lean on the stick more than the carrot.

renewiltord 5y ago

That makes sense. I wasn't sure if SDEs get x units or y dollars worth of stock units each year. The former is most common, but everything about AMZN is unusual, including the vest schedule.

TFortunato 5y ago
Amazon does it in dollars. Employees have a target comp figure in dollars, the annual stock refreshers are based on the price of the stock at that time, so if you got 100 units one year, and the stock doubles, all things being equal, you would only get 50 units the next year at refresh time. In practice this means you can make good money off your hiring grant if price keeps going up, but you will also see your total comp hit a cliff / drop after a few years, since while stock going up is usually good, in Amazon's eyes, you've been lucky to be making more than your target comp those years and they aren't going to keep giving you the same amount of units if those units are worth more.

thanhhaimai 5y ago

That logic applies when you joined a while ago. However, with the stock sky high (P/E 66, double GOOG 33), joining Amazon right now may not give you that potential upside anymore. Your managers and long time careers will get a larger portion of the upside. It's already evident by the stock growth of GOOG compared to AMZN in the past one year/quarter. The P/E of Amazon is high, compared with the growth potential vs others in FAANG. Picking a company to join is also akin to pick a stock to invest. Low P/E is not everything, but it's an important part of the equation. For non-Staff level SWEs, my opinion is that joining a FAANG with lower P/E is better for your future earnings.

testing_1_2_3_4 5y ago
Amazon's PE has always been this high
- state_less 5y ago
  But their market cap hasn’t. Odds are they won’t 5x their size in the next five years as they did in their last five.
  - bin_bash 5y ago
    That's what people said 5 years ago.
    - WJW 5y ago
      Eventually they'll start being right. Not even Amazon can grow at this pace forever.
  - 55555 5y ago
    Their retail business is still in a tiny portion of the world.
    - testing_1_2_3_4 5y ago