5 ms·

Most of these were taught in required courses when I was in school, and I have no reason to believe this has changed: media competency - part of history class,

Most of these were taught in required courses when I was in school, and I have no reason to believe this has changed: media competency - part of history class, including evaluating sources, history of yellow journalism, etc. scientific method - 6+ years of science class cui bono - this is apparently a fancy term for motive, which was discussed during history class (specifically explaining the judicial branch) negotiations, assertiveness, how to deal with bullies - a required part of working on group projects for 6+ years of life mental health basics, mechanics of addiction - health class Economics 101 is the only one on your list that was missing, and presumably a financial literacy course would cover this.

kccqzy 5y ago
These do not seem sufficient in my opinion. The reliance of history class to teach media competency in modern times for example very much depends on the quality of instruction. For an average teacher the history class would be filled with historical facts without reference to the modern times. Similarly, science class tends to teach knowledge (including knowledge of the scientific method) but not actually applying the scientific method to any real-life scenarios. Even with science labs, students might use the scientific method during class only, without extending it to decision making in life. Negotiations and stuff can be learned from group projects? No way. Group projects are primarily cooperative and students share the fruits of their combined labor. How does that relate to life scenarios like, negotiating a lease agreement with a landlord who has very different incentives? Or negotiating a job offer with a prospective employer when there is a clear mismatch in power between the two? It doesn't.
- maximus-decimus 5y ago
  Given we don't even use the scientific method to determine the best subjects to teach, I don't think there will be a push to teach using the scientific method in real life scenarios.
  - 2OEH8eoCRo0 5y ago
    >best subjects to teach Best subjects for what?
    - maximus-decimus 5y ago
      Whatever we decide we want to prepare kids for. Do we want auto-didacts? Do we want them to just be able to do all citizen things like maintain their house/car and do their taxes? Do we want to have the best researchers? Do we want the best athletes? Do we want citizens expert in our own culture/history? The school system has always seemed aimless to me until you hit university where the goal more clearly is to either make you a great professional or a great researcher.
      - quartesixte 5y ago
        It’s aimless because we (I’m assuming American) have decided to drop the one thing public schools were actually designed for: creating citizens that share a common national identity based on having learned the same things and values. It’s a tool of nationalism, and when you forget or willfully expunge that half of public schools (the other half being the creation of a populace that is decently educated enough to engage in civic society), shit starts to look pointless. Edit: As an example of this, most Americans can recite both the pledge of allegiance and a canon of children’s rhymes — yankee doodle, mary had a little lamb, etc. Knowledge of which act as an immediate shibboleth to others that you on some level grew up American.
        2OEH8eoCRo0 5y ago
        >creating citizens that share a common national identity based on having learned the same things and values. This is actually very important for a melting pot country of immigrants.
      - ultrarunner 5y ago
        Can't we just read what the founders of American education modeled it after and what they said they wanted to accomplish? People say that schools are failing, but compared to their stated goals they seem to be humming along alright.
sokoloff 5y ago
I had some decent science teachers in high school. I don’t feel like it gave me a real sense of the scientific method and the labs were mostly technique labs rather than discovery or scientific method labs. I think this was driven by curriculum programming rather than laziness on the teachers’ part.
ClumsyPilot 5y ago
Are you hearing youself? Do you really believe that a class goup project prepares you to negotiate an employment contract or a morthgage? Does a person coming out of scool understand they rights, where to complain if they employer is avuvsing them, can sue a landlord or can read a health insurance contract and understand what it covers? Preposterous

kccqzy 5y ago

These do not seem sufficient in my opinion. The reliance of history class to teach media competency in modern times for example very much depends on the quality of instruction. For an average teacher the history class would be filled with historical facts without reference to the modern times. Similarly, science class tends to teach knowledge (including knowledge of the scientific method) but not actually applying the scientific method to any real-life scenarios. Even with science labs, students might use the scientific method during class only, without extending it to decision making in life. Negotiations and stuff can be learned from group projects? No way. Group projects are primarily cooperative and students share the fruits of their combined labor. How does that relate to life scenarios like, negotiating a lease agreement with a landlord who has very different incentives? Or negotiating a job offer with a prospective employer when there is a clear mismatch in power between the two? It doesn't.

maximus-decimus 5y ago
Given we don't even use the scientific method to determine the best subjects to teach, I don't think there will be a push to teach using the scientific method in real life scenarios.
- 2OEH8eoCRo0 5y ago
  >best subjects to teach Best subjects for what?
  - maximus-decimus 5y ago
    Whatever we decide we want to prepare kids for. Do we want auto-didacts? Do we want them to just be able to do all citizen things like maintain their house/car and do their taxes? Do we want to have the best researchers? Do we want the best athletes? Do we want citizens expert in our own culture/history? The school system has always seemed aimless to me until you hit university where the goal more clearly is to either make you a great professional or a great researcher.
    - quartesixte 5y ago
      It’s aimless because we (I’m assuming American) have decided to drop the one thing public schools were actually designed for: creating citizens that share a common national identity based on having learned the same things and values. It’s a tool of nationalism, and when you forget or willfully expunge that half of public schools (the other half being the creation of a populace that is decently educated enough to engage in civic society), shit starts to look pointless. Edit: As an example of this, most Americans can recite both the pledge of allegiance and a canon of children’s rhymes — yankee doodle, mary had a little lamb, etc. Knowledge of which act as an immediate shibboleth to others that you on some level grew up American.
      - 2OEH8eoCRo0 5y ago
        >creating citizens that share a common national identity based on having learned the same things and values. This is actually very important for a melting pot country of immigrants.
    - ultrarunner 5y ago
      Can't we just read what the founders of American education modeled it after and what they said they wanted to accomplish? People say that schools are failing, but compared to their stated goals they seem to be humming along alright.

sokoloff 5y ago

I had some decent science teachers in high school. I don’t feel like it gave me a real sense of the scientific method and the labs were mostly technique labs rather than discovery or scientific method labs. I think this was driven by curriculum programming rather than laziness on the teachers’ part.

ClumsyPilot 5y ago

Are you hearing youself? Do you really believe that a class goup project prepares you to negotiate an employment contract or a morthgage? Does a person coming out of scool understand they rights, where to complain if they employer is avuvsing them, can sue a landlord or can read a health insurance contract and understand what it covers? Preposterous