5 ms·

I never groped anyone.

by noahbradley 5y ago

deft 5y ago
Noah you are saying this now but your original apology says the opposite. Which is it?
- rkk3 5y ago
  Where do you see that in the original apology? https://www.hipstersofthecoast.com/2020/06/noah-bradley-admits-to-being-a-sexual-predator-at-art-industry-events/ https://www.hipstersofthecoast.com/2020/06/noah-bradley-admi...
  - tptacek 5y ago
    Follow the links from his Wikipedia page and you can see Twitter threads where he responded directly to allegations like this with links to the apology.
    - rkk3 5y ago
      Not very helpful, even with digging I don't see what you are talking about. Please post the link. From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noah_Bradley https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noah_Bradley Live Twitter reference Link https://twitter.com/Blackdeerly/status/1274715678444945412 https://twitter.com/Blackdeerly/status/1274715678444945412 Dead Twitter reference Links https://twitter.com/noahbradley/status/1274670378296774658 https://twitter.com/noahbradley/status/1274670378296774658 https://twitter.com/abigbat/status/1293860934600003585 https://twitter.com/abigbat/status/1293860934600003585
      - tptacek 5y ago
        You can simply follow the first Wikipedia footnote on "cut all ties", in the opening paragraph of the article.
        rkk3 5y ago
        Ok since you don't post links I'll assume you are referring to: 'Bradley’s statement came the morning after concept artist Betty Jiang posted accusations on Twitter about a “bald headed crusty assed ‘well known’ artist who went around groping female devs,” saying that she hoped “to never see you and your shitty v-neck shirts at any workshops or conventions.”' He apologized for a lot of things, but I don't see him admitting to or apologizing for groping anyone. https://www.hipstersofthecoast.com/2020/06/noah-bradley-admits-to-being-a-sexual-predator-at-art-industry-events/ https://www.hipstersofthecoast.com/2020/06/noah-bradley-admi...
        tptacek 5y ago
        As I said: you can see screenshots of threads where he was accused both of "groping" and of taking advantaged of intoxicated women at events, and he responded with a link to the apology. Follow the first footnote from the Wikipedia article, and then click the screenshot on the first message in the Twitter thread. I have no way of judging the veracity of either side of this argument, but it sure looks like the allegations against him were specific --- at the time.
        rkk3 5y ago
        So the tweet paraphrased above, here is the link... Which again he didn't directly reply to and didn't say anything about groping anyone in his apology... Is it really that hard to link? https://twitter.com/BettyDesuJiang/status/1274500595718582273 https://twitter.com/BettyDesuJiang/status/127450059571858227...
        foldr 5y ago
        I think you don't see Noah's reply because he deleted that tweet? At least, I can't find the "a long overdue acknowledgement" tweet on twitter any more. So what tptacek says seems accurate to me.
        rkk3 5y ago
defaultname 5y ago
I wasn't there. I don't know you or any of the other players. I know nothing about this beyond basically the synopsis. Yet what is cited as the origin of the torch mob -- a twitter thread -- has a lot of pretty clear accusations by long time Twitter users, some of whom are fairly well known figures.
- overgard 5y ago
  "Long time twitter user" is a pretty awful metric for credibility.
  - defaultname 5y ago
    Someone with a chip on their shoulder didn't create a bunch of accounts to invent a narrative is the point. It's absolutely an input to consideration. And FWIW, to use Animats' argument that lack of court proceedings is evidence, surely there's a lot of actionable libel in some of those twitter threads if they are invented. If there isn't such proceedings, is that proof that they're all true? I think we've hit a halting problem!
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
reedf1 5y ago
Hey man - be careful reading stuff alright? Probably best to just take a breather from reading stuff about yourself, it can't feel good. Humans weren't designed to be yelled at by more people than you can fit in a room.
- koheripbal 5y ago
  Public apologies are the new porn and bullying people into providing them is a real addiction for some. These depressed people use "consequences" as a brief hit of superiority, allowing them to escape the reality of their own failed lives. ...and as quickly as it picks them up, it is gone again, and they then need to search for that next dose of "justice". Complexity, self-reflection, nuance, are all distractions from what is an emotional addiction. And like any addiction, you cannot satiate it by giving it more of what it craves. Apologies attract more of them, and they go back to hit the apologizer for more "consequences", like trying to get the last little hit, even if they can see there's nothing left. Don't engage these people. They are worthless.
  - tptacek 5y ago
    I don't think this is the only reasonable reading of the situation, and your framing here is pretty inflammatory. We're supposed to get calmer and more careful in our writing as topics get complicated; see the guidelines at the bottom of the page.
    - koheripbal 5y ago
      This person's career was destroyed because of an online mob. ...and that mob is not psychologically healthy. The online vengeance mob is a toxic and destructive part of our world.
      - tptacek 5y ago
        I don't think "online mob" is the only reasonable reading here, and the claim that the people telling the other side of this story must be psychologically unhealthy is also inflammatory, as is talking about its "toxicity" and "destructiveness". This isn't shedding any more light, or rewarding curiosity, which are the goals of the site.
broberts01 5y ago
I don't think anyone is inclined to believe one way or the other. It is a gray area and with the way you described what you did, it certainly seems plausible. You even say you were drunk and did stupid things. It is plausible that you wouldn't even remember doing it.
- stavros 5y ago
  Right, but until someone, you know, actually comes out and accuses him of it, shouldn't we assume he didn't?
gamblor956 5y ago
I know of at least 5 women who stopped attending these events because of you, and their (near-)contemporaneous accounts of your behavior does not match your current recollections of your past behavior.
- koheripbal 5y ago
  I'm not inclined to believe 3rd party rumors. If anything, your comment is exactly the problem OP is talking about.
  - gamblor956 5y ago
    In addition to actually witnessing Noah act like a drunken idiot, I was made aware of Noah's more inappropriate behavior contemporaneously with it happening...in two cases, within minutes of him playing drunken grab-ass, and in the remaining cases, the next day. That being said, I'm also not surprised that people on HN side with a man with a history of sexually harassment over his victims. For inexplicable reasons, the HN crowd seems to think that because they're awkward around women that the same thing that happened to Noah can happen to them, but being awkward around women is not sexual harassment. Just don't grab a woman's body without her permission or try to proposition her within minutes of meeting her, and you'll be fine.
croes 5y ago
That's what a groper would say.

I never groped anyone.

deft 5y ago

Noah you are saying this now but your original apology says the opposite. Which is it?

rkk3 5y ago
Where do you see that in the original apology? https://www.hipstersofthecoast.com/2020/06/noah-bradley-admits-to-being-a-sexual-predator-at-art-industry-events/ https://www.hipstersofthecoast.com/2020/06/noah-bradley-admi...
- tptacek 5y ago
  Follow the links from his Wikipedia page and you can see Twitter threads where he responded directly to allegations like this with links to the apology.
  - rkk3 5y ago
    Not very helpful, even with digging I don't see what you are talking about. Please post the link. From https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noah_Bradley https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noah_Bradley Live Twitter reference Link https://twitter.com/Blackdeerly/status/1274715678444945412 https://twitter.com/Blackdeerly/status/1274715678444945412 Dead Twitter reference Links https://twitter.com/noahbradley/status/1274670378296774658 https://twitter.com/noahbradley/status/1274670378296774658 https://twitter.com/abigbat/status/1293860934600003585 https://twitter.com/abigbat/status/1293860934600003585
    - tptacek 5y ago
      You can simply follow the first Wikipedia footnote on "cut all ties", in the opening paragraph of the article.
      - rkk3 5y ago
        Ok since you don't post links I'll assume you are referring to: 'Bradley’s statement came the morning after concept artist Betty Jiang posted accusations on Twitter about a “bald headed crusty assed ‘well known’ artist who went around groping female devs,” saying that she hoped “to never see you and your shitty v-neck shirts at any workshops or conventions.”' He apologized for a lot of things, but I don't see him admitting to or apologizing for groping anyone. https://www.hipstersofthecoast.com/2020/06/noah-bradley-admits-to-being-a-sexual-predator-at-art-industry-events/ https://www.hipstersofthecoast.com/2020/06/noah-bradley-admi...
        tptacek 5y ago
        As I said: you can see screenshots of threads where he was accused both of "groping" and of taking advantaged of intoxicated women at events, and he responded with a link to the apology. Follow the first footnote from the Wikipedia article, and then click the screenshot on the first message in the Twitter thread. I have no way of judging the veracity of either side of this argument, but it sure looks like the allegations against him were specific --- at the time.
        rkk3 5y ago
        So the tweet paraphrased above, here is the link... Which again he didn't directly reply to and didn't say anything about groping anyone in his apology... Is it really that hard to link? https://twitter.com/BettyDesuJiang/status/1274500595718582273 https://twitter.com/BettyDesuJiang/status/127450059571858227...
        foldr 5y ago
        I think you don't see Noah's reply because he deleted that tweet? At least, I can't find the "a long overdue acknowledgement" tweet on twitter any more. So what tptacek says seems accurate to me.
        rkk3 5y ago

defaultname 5y ago

I wasn't there. I don't know you or any of the other players. I know nothing about this beyond basically the synopsis. Yet what is cited as the origin of the torch mob -- a twitter thread -- has a lot of pretty clear accusations by long time Twitter users, some of whom are fairly well known figures.

overgard 5y ago
"Long time twitter user" is a pretty awful metric for credibility.
- defaultname 5y ago
  Someone with a chip on their shoulder didn't create a bunch of accounts to invent a narrative is the point. It's absolutely an input to consideration. And FWIW, to use Animats' argument that lack of court proceedings is evidence, surely there's a lot of actionable libel in some of those twitter threads if they are invented. If there isn't such proceedings, is that proof that they're all true? I think we've hit a halting problem!

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

reedf1 5y ago

Hey man - be careful reading stuff alright? Probably best to just take a breather from reading stuff about yourself, it can't feel good. Humans weren't designed to be yelled at by more people than you can fit in a room.

koheripbal 5y ago
Public apologies are the new porn and bullying people into providing them is a real addiction for some. These depressed people use "consequences" as a brief hit of superiority, allowing them to escape the reality of their own failed lives. ...and as quickly as it picks them up, it is gone again, and they then need to search for that next dose of "justice". Complexity, self-reflection, nuance, are all distractions from what is an emotional addiction. And like any addiction, you cannot satiate it by giving it more of what it craves. Apologies attract more of them, and they go back to hit the apologizer for more "consequences", like trying to get the last little hit, even if they can see there's nothing left. Don't engage these people. They are worthless.
- tptacek 5y ago
  I don't think this is the only reasonable reading of the situation, and your framing here is pretty inflammatory. We're supposed to get calmer and more careful in our writing as topics get complicated; see the guidelines at the bottom of the page.
  - koheripbal 5y ago
    This person's career was destroyed because of an online mob. ...and that mob is not psychologically healthy. The online vengeance mob is a toxic and destructive part of our world.
    - tptacek 5y ago
      I don't think "online mob" is the only reasonable reading here, and the claim that the people telling the other side of this story must be psychologically unhealthy is also inflammatory, as is talking about its "toxicity" and "destructiveness". This isn't shedding any more light, or rewarding curiosity, which are the goals of the site.

broberts01 5y ago

I don't think anyone is inclined to believe one way or the other. It is a gray area and with the way you described what you did, it certainly seems plausible. You even say you were drunk and did stupid things. It is plausible that you wouldn't even remember doing it.

stavros 5y ago
Right, but until someone, you know, actually comes out and accuses him of it, shouldn't we assume he didn't?

gamblor956 5y ago

I know of at least 5 women who stopped attending these events because of you, and their (near-)contemporaneous accounts of your behavior does not match your current recollections of your past behavior.

koheripbal 5y ago
I'm not inclined to believe 3rd party rumors. If anything, your comment is exactly the problem OP is talking about.
- gamblor956 5y ago
  In addition to actually witnessing Noah act like a drunken idiot, I was made aware of Noah's more inappropriate behavior contemporaneously with it happening...in two cases, within minutes of him playing drunken grab-ass, and in the remaining cases, the next day. That being said, I'm also not surprised that people on HN side with a man with a history of sexually harassment over his victims. For inexplicable reasons, the HN crowd seems to think that because they're awkward around women that the same thing that happened to Noah can happen to them, but being awkward around women is not sexual harassment. Just don't grab a woman's body without her permission or try to proposition her within minutes of meeting her, and you'll be fine.

croes 5y ago

That's what a groper would say.