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I would very much prefer that we completely abolish tipping. My wife and I went to a restaurant recently where they had a sign on the table declaring that there

I would very much prefer that we completely abolish tipping. My wife and I went to a restaurant recently where they had a sign on the table declaring that there would be a 20% tip automatically added to every bill because their employees are “worth more than $2.15 an hour“. I don’t know why but I found that to be very offensive, it’s as if saying yes our employees are worth more than $2.15 an hour, but we the business are not going to pay it.

missedthecue 5y ago
Where do you think businesses get the money to pay for things
- underseacables 5y ago
  When a business has to shame customers into tipping or require mandatory tips, maybe they should not be in business? Perhaps that’s a little extreme, here’s a better one: raise the prices. Pay your employees a fair wage and stop whining that you can’t afford it, because you can afford it, and if you can’t, then perhaps your business model is not sustainable.
  - missedthecue 5y ago
    doesn't sound like they shamed. Sounds like they increased the price of a meal by 20%.
    - Brian_K_White 5y ago
      Of course they shamed. There is no other way to describe it. If they wanted to pay their employees more, they can simply do so. If they want to charge the customers more to pay for the employees, they can simply do so. There is no legitimate explicable purpose to packaging up this action in this very peculiar way. I am just trying to imagine this is any other context. Just imagine my employers invoice for my programming or sysadmin time itemized as "$110 with an involuntary 20% tip because our analysts are worth more than plumbers"
- pwinnski 5y ago
  If you're going to add 20% to every bill, then put that on the menu where you list prices. That's a not a $10 item, that's a $12 item. Otherwise, the sanctimony is wrapped in condescension, communicating that not only do they think they're better than you for tipping (with your money) 20% rather than whatever lower percentage they thought you were going to top, they also think you're so stupid that you'll still think the prices printed on the menu are the actual prices.
bitshiftfaced 5y ago
Sounds like you got your wish. You ate at a place that abolished tips. In my book, a tip that's not optional is not a tip at all. It's a service fee.
- me_me_me 5y ago
  They didnt abolish tips, they force customers to pay untaxed tips. There is a difference.
  - bitshiftfaced 5y ago
    What does whether it's taxed or not have to do with it? (By the way, if the customer pays with credit card, that tip will most likely be taxed.) If your automotive repair shop changed a line on their receipt from "20% service fee" to "20% obligatory tip which will be deducted from employee's pay check," it would work the same way.
    - underseacables 5y ago
      I think you might be looking at this from the wrong direction, if I may. If you pay with your meal and put a tip on your credit card, you are taxed. When the server claims their tips at the end of the evening, those tips are than taxed. Those are two different things.
      - bitshiftfaced 5y ago
        I was referring to the practice of restaurants not reporting income from cash tips but usually doing so for tips using credit cards, since an auditor can "see" that income.
  - xtiansimon 5y ago
    I’m a bookkeeper for restaurant…Auto-gratuity is subject to sales tax in NY. Unsolicited tips are non-taxed.
oceanghost 5y ago
Isn't that the whole tipping problem in a nutshell? It's this awful unfair system that even the customers don't want to participate in, but businesses force it on us for their convenience.

missedthecue 5y ago

Where do you think businesses get the money to pay for things

underseacables 5y ago
When a business has to shame customers into tipping or require mandatory tips, maybe they should not be in business? Perhaps that’s a little extreme, here’s a better one: raise the prices. Pay your employees a fair wage and stop whining that you can’t afford it, because you can afford it, and if you can’t, then perhaps your business model is not sustainable.
- missedthecue 5y ago
  doesn't sound like they shamed. Sounds like they increased the price of a meal by 20%.
  - Brian_K_White 5y ago
    Of course they shamed. There is no other way to describe it. If they wanted to pay their employees more, they can simply do so. If they want to charge the customers more to pay for the employees, they can simply do so. There is no legitimate explicable purpose to packaging up this action in this very peculiar way. I am just trying to imagine this is any other context. Just imagine my employers invoice for my programming or sysadmin time itemized as "$110 with an involuntary 20% tip because our analysts are worth more than plumbers"
pwinnski 5y ago
If you're going to add 20% to every bill, then put that on the menu where you list prices. That's a not a $10 item, that's a $12 item. Otherwise, the sanctimony is wrapped in condescension, communicating that not only do they think they're better than you for tipping (with your money) 20% rather than whatever lower percentage they thought you were going to top, they also think you're so stupid that you'll still think the prices printed on the menu are the actual prices.

bitshiftfaced 5y ago

Sounds like you got your wish. You ate at a place that abolished tips. In my book, a tip that's not optional is not a tip at all. It's a service fee.

me_me_me 5y ago
They didnt abolish tips, they force customers to pay untaxed tips. There is a difference.
- bitshiftfaced 5y ago
  What does whether it's taxed or not have to do with it? (By the way, if the customer pays with credit card, that tip will most likely be taxed.) If your automotive repair shop changed a line on their receipt from "20% service fee" to "20% obligatory tip which will be deducted from employee's pay check," it would work the same way.
  - underseacables 5y ago
    I think you might be looking at this from the wrong direction, if I may. If you pay with your meal and put a tip on your credit card, you are taxed. When the server claims their tips at the end of the evening, those tips are than taxed. Those are two different things.
    - bitshiftfaced 5y ago
      I was referring to the practice of restaurants not reporting income from cash tips but usually doing so for tips using credit cards, since an auditor can "see" that income.
- xtiansimon 5y ago
  I’m a bookkeeper for restaurant…Auto-gratuity is subject to sales tax in NY. Unsolicited tips are non-taxed.

oceanghost 5y ago

Isn't that the whole tipping problem in a nutshell? It's this awful unfair system that even the customers don't want to participate in, but businesses force it on us for their convenience.