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What you're describing isn't real life. Living as a species takes work - granting a portion of the population to essentially become dead weight, with entitleme

What you're describing isn't real life. Living as a species takes work - granting a portion of the population to essentially become dead weight, with entitlement to being able to live off the fruits of other peoples labor won't end well.

nicbou 5y ago
Our species wears pants, flies airplanes and invented cocaine. The argument about what's natural and what isn't is rather ridiculous to make.
- RhodoGSA 5y ago
  i didn't say natural, i said real life. Those things are all products of labor, without that labor they wouldn't exist.
EliRivers 5y ago
This is what we have now, is it not? The ultra-rich aren't numerous and many of them hide well, but this is what they're doing and the amount of wealth they seem to hoard (and be continually acquiring) is a lot more than the wealth needed to provide for the bottom. The less rich (but still very rich) who do still choose to work are similarly siphoning off large amounts from the backs of others. They are very skilled at getting the majority of the population to look the other way and blame poor people (and the other usual suspects), but as you suggest, they can't hide forever. If that won't end well, I genuinely look forwards to seeing how we deal with them.
- RhodoGSA 5y ago
  the ultra-rich built amazon, made very profitable trades, or inherited the labor of the ancestors. Also, you seems to be applying that there is a fixed pie wealth. The rich can create wealth where there wasn't before. Rob the rich and give to the poor is also a terrible strategy.
  - EliRivers 5y ago
    inherited the labor of the ancestors Bingo. They didn't do shit to deserve it, they didn't work hard, and there's an entire industry of smart, morally ambiguous people dedicated to helping them hide it and keep it, and (as Abigail Disney discusses) convincing them that they deserve it, that poor people would simply waste it. granting a portion of the population to essentially become dead weight, with entitlement to being able to live off the fruits of other peoples labor won't end well Well, there they are, doing just that. Once you get to a certain amount of wealth, you don't need to do anything. Smart trades? None of that's needed. I'm a tiny little part of it; I work full-time, but once my personal wealth reached about six times my salary, it made more money each year than I did. Six times [0]. That is pennies in the big scheme of things. There's nothing smart about my trades; dull funds and diversity. Piketty was on to something; Bill Gates made more money from being rich than he ever did from Microsoft. Maybe he deserved all his riches from Microsoft, but does he now also deserve to sit back, do nothing, and perpetually watch his wealth grow more and more obscenely by taking a part of the wealth generated by people actually working? How about his Grandchildren? Do they deserve that? Young was right; meritocracy is what we've got, and this is what it does - the rich shall inherit the earth. Also, you seems to be applying that there is a fixed pie wealth. I disagree. I made no such "application", as you put it. Implying, I guess you mean, but I still disagree. There is not a fixed pie wealth. Every day, a lot of people are creating more and more wealth, and the very wealthy every day sit back and rake in a nice helping of it for themselves. As I also do, and I'm not remotely near very wealthy. Rob the rich and give to the poor is also a terrible strategy. How about "make them at least pay taxes like the poor schlubs generating the wealth they're perpetually helping themselves to?" Is that a better strategy? How about "alter the system a bit so that labour pays better than simply being rich, or at least benefits the labourer ahead of the rich?" That one probably sounds like batshit crazy communist land. [0] It's ridiculous, but it's true. I don't do calls, I don't do puts, most of it is in dull index funds and a big chunk of the rest is in slightly less dull fund offerings from Baillie Gifford and the like. Once you get some capital, it will happily act like a leech on society, siphoning off wealth generated by other people's work into your own pocket. I ride on the very, very long tail of this system set up to benefit the rich; I only hope that I die before their endless squeeze catches up with me as well.

nicbou 5y ago

Our species wears pants, flies airplanes and invented cocaine. The argument about what's natural and what isn't is rather ridiculous to make.

RhodoGSA 5y ago
i didn't say natural, i said real life. Those things are all products of labor, without that labor they wouldn't exist.

EliRivers 5y ago

This is what we have now, is it not? The ultra-rich aren't numerous and many of them hide well, but this is what they're doing and the amount of wealth they seem to hoard (and be continually acquiring) is a lot more than the wealth needed to provide for the bottom. The less rich (but still very rich) who do still choose to work are similarly siphoning off large amounts from the backs of others. They are very skilled at getting the majority of the population to look the other way and blame poor people (and the other usual suspects), but as you suggest, they can't hide forever. If that won't end well, I genuinely look forwards to seeing how we deal with them.

RhodoGSA 5y ago
the ultra-rich built amazon, made very profitable trades, or inherited the labor of the ancestors. Also, you seems to be applying that there is a fixed pie wealth. The rich can create wealth where there wasn't before. Rob the rich and give to the poor is also a terrible strategy.
- EliRivers 5y ago
  inherited the labor of the ancestors Bingo. They didn't do shit to deserve it, they didn't work hard, and there's an entire industry of smart, morally ambiguous people dedicated to helping them hide it and keep it, and (as Abigail Disney discusses) convincing them that they deserve it, that poor people would simply waste it. granting a portion of the population to essentially become dead weight, with entitlement to being able to live off the fruits of other peoples labor won't end well Well, there they are, doing just that. Once you get to a certain amount of wealth, you don't need to do anything. Smart trades? None of that's needed. I'm a tiny little part of it; I work full-time, but once my personal wealth reached about six times my salary, it made more money each year than I did. Six times [0]. That is pennies in the big scheme of things. There's nothing smart about my trades; dull funds and diversity. Piketty was on to something; Bill Gates made more money from being rich than he ever did from Microsoft. Maybe he deserved all his riches from Microsoft, but does he now also deserve to sit back, do nothing, and perpetually watch his wealth grow more and more obscenely by taking a part of the wealth generated by people actually working? How about his Grandchildren? Do they deserve that? Young was right; meritocracy is what we've got, and this is what it does - the rich shall inherit the earth. Also, you seems to be applying that there is a fixed pie wealth. I disagree. I made no such "application", as you put it. Implying, I guess you mean, but I still disagree. There is not a fixed pie wealth. Every day, a lot of people are creating more and more wealth, and the very wealthy every day sit back and rake in a nice helping of it for themselves. As I also do, and I'm not remotely near very wealthy. Rob the rich and give to the poor is also a terrible strategy. How about "make them at least pay taxes like the poor schlubs generating the wealth they're perpetually helping themselves to?" Is that a better strategy? How about "alter the system a bit so that labour pays better than simply being rich, or at least benefits the labourer ahead of the rich?" That one probably sounds like batshit crazy communist land. [0] It's ridiculous, but it's true. I don't do calls, I don't do puts, most of it is in dull index funds and a big chunk of the rest is in slightly less dull fund offerings from Baillie Gifford and the like. Once you get some capital, it will happily act like a leech on society, siphoning off wealth generated by other people's work into your own pocket. I ride on the very, very long tail of this system set up to benefit the rich; I only hope that I die before their endless squeeze catches up with me as well.