6 ms·

Time management trips I learned from years of hating Tim Ferriss (2009)

82 points by enigmatic02 5y ago

markozivanovic 5y ago
The more posts I read that are about people hating Tim, the more I like the guy. He found a way to market himself so efficiently, he can live off posts like these for many years to come - which I find fair because haters are often toxic and make claims that are hard to prove. The author wanted to use Tim to hang out with cool people at the conference - it backfired and she was hurt, implying that Tim tricked her. Did he? We'll never know. When I read that first one, I saw where this was going... Also, the way the post ends - that's a really nasty comment about a person. The author outright says that Tim is not a kind person and not a good person. It seems to me that the author is not either of those things if judging purely on this one blog post. Why so much hate? This seems like a personal attack wrapped in some kind of a productivity blog post.
- rhencke 5y ago
  Why would you judge a person based purely on what other people say about them, and not on your own interactions with them?
Ecstatify 5y ago
This blog is crazy. There’s even a vendetta section. Love it! https://penelopetrunk.com/katie-anderson-cassie-boorn/ https://penelopetrunk.com/katie-anderson-cassie-boorn/
- schwartzworld 5y ago
  Yeah, she's the one who came under fire years ago for getting implants because she thought she would make more money with a larger chest.
  - endofreach 5y ago
    Today she‘d rather get some work done on her trunk, I guess.
yarcob 5y ago
The funny thing is that Ferris isn't even hiding what he's doing. According to the book (I read a couple of pages in the Amazon preview) he decided on the title "The 4 work week" by A/B testing various titles and using what gets most clicks. He just writes whatever people want to hear and even tells you that this is what he is doing! There is nothing to learn from someone like that.
- shapefrog 5y ago
  I am pretty sure you just outlined some excelent lessons while claiming there is nothing to be learnt from them.
- Cycl0ps 5y ago
  In full, Ferris' book is about how to adjust a business to operate without direct oversight, along with adjusting your own lifestyle to live off of whatever income that generates. One of the key points to that is making a product to fit an unsatisfied market. There was a desire from people to earn a decent living while cutting out unnecessary work, so he used past experiences to create a product for that market. It happens to be self referential at points, but that's done to show the concepts work. He could just as easily leave the out and have the audience be none the wiser. By no means is the book a panacea on entrepreneurship, Tim focuses on outsourcing in many places where digital automation could handle the work and his definition of Work is "things I don't want to do" rather than "billable hours" so it's unclear if even he meets the books titular goal.
- eloff 5y ago
  > There is nothing to learn from someone like that. I was with you right up to the end. Obviously there are plenty of things to learn, and you identified some of them. How you judge those lessons according to your own values will vary, but they're not vacuous.
vondro 5y ago
Good read. A bit like the No Mercy, No Malice blog of Scott Galloway, but without the "No Malice" part. Having a family now I really seconded the part about relationships. It's easy and OK to spend a lot of time after work for personal projects/learning when you're living alone, not so much with kids (imho).
- shapefrog 5y ago
  The Two Hour Family, get it where all good books are sold /.
kbos87 5y ago
I simultaneously believe everything the author said, and also feel like it comes off as bitter and personal. Tim Ferris embodies an approach to the world that I feel like I’ve seen taken over and over again. It’s a cynical approach to work and the world that relies on achievement through shortcuts and technicalities rather than actually doing the work, and in some cases, rather than producing anything of value.
trhoad 5y ago
What a bitter, pointless post. Being less of a douchebag than another douchebag doesn't mean you're not a douchebag.
- Topgamer7 5y ago
  What a bitter, pointless comment. Pointing out douchbags are being less douchebaggy then another douchebag doesn't mean you aren't a douchebag.
  - endofreach 5y ago
    What a pointless comment.
  - trhoad 5y ago
    Makes absolutely no sense.
canadianfella 5y ago
How hard is it to copy and paste?
tailspin2019 5y ago
> I have hated Tim Ferriss for a long time. Personally I'm immediately wary of an article which starts off with how much hate someone has for another person. But aside from that. This is from 2009. And a lot of the opinions I see in the comments here seem from that era too. Tim Ferris is now a lot more than the 4 Hour Work Week (whatever you think of that book - admittedly it is very polarising). I would encourage anyone who hasn't delved into his material more recently to do so. On his podcast, he's become a very good interviewer over the years, who asks thoughtful questions and leaves "space" for the interviewee to speak (unlike many other podcasters) and has increasingly not shied away from difficult topics. Personally I think that some of his output on depression, anxiety [0], childhood abuse [1] and suicide [2] is incredibly important. Especially where the traditional view might be that to talk about such personal things may not be good for one's "image". It's not done with any sensationalism, it just comes across as someone who has become "ok enough" with themselves to be able to talk more openly about their own struggles. (As someone who is no stranger to mental health struggles, I find listening to him speak on this topic to be incredibly relatable.) I happen to also like a lot of his more practical, life-hack output as well, but I think it's important to recognise that he has rounded out over the years and has a bit more to offer now than the slightly narrow 4HWW caricature which still seems to persist. [0] "Productivity" Tricks for the Neurotic, Manic-Depressive, and Crazy (Like Me) https://tim.blog/2013/11/03/productivity-hacks/ https://tim.blog/2013/11/03/productivity-hacks/ [1] My Healing Journey After Childhood Abuse (Includes Extensive Resource List) https://tim.blog/2020/09/14/how-to-heal-trauma/ https://tim.blog/2020/09/14/how-to-heal-trauma/ [2] Some Practical Thoughts on Suicide https://tim.blog/2015/05/06/how-to-commit-suicide/ https://tim.blog/2015/05/06/how-to-commit-suicide/ EDIT: Wow, just browsed this lady's blog a bit more and seems she has a bit of a part time hobby of posting about people she "hates". Not a good look.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- klelatti 5y ago
  Also credit to TF for the sheer volume and variety of very long form podcast interviews of usually very high quality. I sort of see him as a curator of interesting guests now - very often individuals I've never heard of. Some of those interviews have changed my perspective on the world. Just wish I had time to listen to more of them.

82 points by enigmatic02 5y ago

The more posts I read that are about people hating Tim, the more I like the guy. He found a way to market himself so efficiently, he can live off posts like these for many years to come - which I find fair because haters are often toxic and make claims that are hard to prove. The author wanted to use Tim to hang out with cool people at the conference - it backfired and she was hurt, implying that Tim tricked her. Did he? We'll never know. When I read that first one, I saw where this was going... Also, the way the post ends - that's a really nasty comment about a person. The author outright says that Tim is not a kind person and not a good person. It seems to me that the author is not either of those things if judging purely on this one blog post. Why so much hate? This seems like a personal attack wrapped in some kind of a productivity blog post.

rhencke 5y ago
Why would you judge a person based purely on what other people say about them, and not on your own interactions with them?

Ecstatify 5y ago

This blog is crazy. There’s even a vendetta section. Love it! https://penelopetrunk.com/katie-anderson-cassie-boorn/ https://penelopetrunk.com/katie-anderson-cassie-boorn/

schwartzworld 5y ago
Yeah, she's the one who came under fire years ago for getting implants because she thought she would make more money with a larger chest.
- endofreach 5y ago
  Today she‘d rather get some work done on her trunk, I guess.

yarcob 5y ago

The funny thing is that Ferris isn't even hiding what he's doing. According to the book (I read a couple of pages in the Amazon preview) he decided on the title "The 4 work week" by A/B testing various titles and using what gets most clicks. He just writes whatever people want to hear and even tells you that this is what he is doing! There is nothing to learn from someone like that.

shapefrog 5y ago
I am pretty sure you just outlined some excelent lessons while claiming there is nothing to be learnt from them.
Cycl0ps 5y ago
In full, Ferris' book is about how to adjust a business to operate without direct oversight, along with adjusting your own lifestyle to live off of whatever income that generates. One of the key points to that is making a product to fit an unsatisfied market. There was a desire from people to earn a decent living while cutting out unnecessary work, so he used past experiences to create a product for that market. It happens to be self referential at points, but that's done to show the concepts work. He could just as easily leave the out and have the audience be none the wiser. By no means is the book a panacea on entrepreneurship, Tim focuses on outsourcing in many places where digital automation could handle the work and his definition of Work is "things I don't want to do" rather than "billable hours" so it's unclear if even he meets the books titular goal.
eloff 5y ago
> There is nothing to learn from someone like that. I was with you right up to the end. Obviously there are plenty of things to learn, and you identified some of them. How you judge those lessons according to your own values will vary, but they're not vacuous.

vondro 5y ago

Good read. A bit like the No Mercy, No Malice blog of Scott Galloway, but without the "No Malice" part. Having a family now I really seconded the part about relationships. It's easy and OK to spend a lot of time after work for personal projects/learning when you're living alone, not so much with kids (imho).

shapefrog 5y ago
The Two Hour Family, get it where all good books are sold /.

kbos87 5y ago

I simultaneously believe everything the author said, and also feel like it comes off as bitter and personal. Tim Ferris embodies an approach to the world that I feel like I’ve seen taken over and over again. It’s a cynical approach to work and the world that relies on achievement through shortcuts and technicalities rather than actually doing the work, and in some cases, rather than producing anything of value.

trhoad 5y ago

What a bitter, pointless post. Being less of a douchebag than another douchebag doesn't mean you're not a douchebag.

Topgamer7 5y ago
What a bitter, pointless comment. Pointing out douchbags are being less douchebaggy then another douchebag doesn't mean you aren't a douchebag.
- endofreach 5y ago
  What a pointless comment.
- trhoad 5y ago
  Makes absolutely no sense.

canadianfella 5y ago

How hard is it to copy and paste?

tailspin2019 5y ago

> I have hated Tim Ferriss for a long time. Personally I'm immediately wary of an article which starts off with how much hate someone has for another person. But aside from that. This is from 2009. And a lot of the opinions I see in the comments here seem from that era too. Tim Ferris is now a lot more than the 4 Hour Work Week (whatever you think of that book - admittedly it is very polarising). I would encourage anyone who hasn't delved into his material more recently to do so. On his podcast, he's become a very good interviewer over the years, who asks thoughtful questions and leaves "space" for the interviewee to speak (unlike many other podcasters) and has increasingly not shied away from difficult topics. Personally I think that some of his output on depression, anxiety [0], childhood abuse [1] and suicide [2] is incredibly important. Especially where the traditional view might be that to talk about such personal things may not be good for one's "image". It's not done with any sensationalism, it just comes across as someone who has become "ok enough" with themselves to be able to talk more openly about their own struggles. (As someone who is no stranger to mental health struggles, I find listening to him speak on this topic to be incredibly relatable.) I happen to also like a lot of his more practical, life-hack output as well, but I think it's important to recognise that he has rounded out over the years and has a bit more to offer now than the slightly narrow 4HWW caricature which still seems to persist. [0] "Productivity" Tricks for the Neurotic, Manic-Depressive, and Crazy (Like Me) https://tim.blog/2013/11/03/productivity-hacks/ https://tim.blog/2013/11/03/productivity-hacks/ [1] My Healing Journey After Childhood Abuse (Includes Extensive Resource List) https://tim.blog/2020/09/14/how-to-heal-trauma/ https://tim.blog/2020/09/14/how-to-heal-trauma/ [2] Some Practical Thoughts on Suicide https://tim.blog/2015/05/06/how-to-commit-suicide/ https://tim.blog/2015/05/06/how-to-commit-suicide/ EDIT: Wow, just browsed this lady's blog a bit more and seems she has a bit of a part time hobby of posting about people she "hates". Not a good look.

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
klelatti 5y ago
Also credit to TF for the sheer volume and variety of very long form podcast interviews of usually very high quality. I sort of see him as a curator of interesting guests now - very often individuals I've never heard of. Some of those interviews have changed my perspective on the world. Just wish I had time to listen to more of them.