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Thanks for sharing this - as a former jazz musician I find this problem space fascinating, and have thought a lot about it in free time. Here's [1] another pape

Thanks for sharing this - as a former jazz musician I find this problem space fascinating, and have thought a lot about it in free time. Here's [1] another paper I found a little more approachable, stating that ratios between 1:1 to 3.5:1 are found in recordings. [1] https://www.ntnu.edu/documents/1001201110/1266017954/DAFx-15_submission_59.pdf https://www.ntnu.edu/documents/1001201110/1266017954/DAFx-15...

leephillips 5y ago
I’m just a listener, but also find this fascinating. I think the jazz is in some ways a revival of baroque performance traditions. Improvisation was hugely important in the baroque, and also they had their own version of swung rhythm; what was notated as a string of 8th notes was not played that way.
- singingfish 5y ago
  my sax teacher says that if you swing Bach you get jazz.
yesenadam 5y ago
This was one I came across a while back, was very useful: Jazz drummers’ swing ratio in relation to tempo. It seems far easier to understand than a few I checked out today including yours and the OP. And it sounds like the authors know what they're talking about, which is not the norm in papers about aspects of jazz. http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.416.5617&rep=rep1&type=pdf http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.416... It looks at the swing ratios of great drummers, i.e. people who actually swing! Tony, Jack, Tain and..well ok, Adam Nussbaum on an Aebersold playalong is a bizarre choice. It has some good graphs though, especially Figure 1. Mean swing ratio as a function of tempo (left) and absolute duration of second note as a function of tempo (right) for the four drummers and all excerpts and Figure 2. Swing ratio for the four drummers as a function of tempo.
- jmbylsma 5y ago
  Any chance you could post another link or the title of the paper? citeseerx.ist.psu.edu appears to be at least temporarily offline.
  - yesenadam 5y ago
    Oh sorry, it's Preferred swing ratio in jazz as a function of tempo, by Anders Friberg and Andreas Sundström. Here's another PDF link: https://www.diva-portal.org/smash/get/diva2:1246291/DATASET01 https://www.diva-portal.org/smash/get/diva2:1246291/DATASET0...
    - jmbylsma 5y ago
      Thank you!

leephillips 5y ago

I’m just a listener, but also find this fascinating. I think the jazz is in some ways a revival of baroque performance traditions. Improvisation was hugely important in the baroque, and also they had their own version of swung rhythm; what was notated as a string of 8th notes was not played that way.

singingfish 5y ago
my sax teacher says that if you swing Bach you get jazz.

yesenadam 5y ago

This was one I came across a while back, was very useful: Jazz drummers’ swing ratio in relation to tempo. It seems far easier to understand than a few I checked out today including yours and the OP. And it sounds like the authors know what they're talking about, which is not the norm in papers about aspects of jazz. http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.416.5617&rep=rep1&type=pdf http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.416... It looks at the swing ratios of great drummers, i.e. people who actually swing! Tony, Jack, Tain and..well ok, Adam Nussbaum on an Aebersold playalong is a bizarre choice. It has some good graphs though, especially Figure 1. Mean swing ratio as a function of tempo (left) and absolute duration of second note as a function of tempo (right) for the four drummers and all excerpts and Figure 2. Swing ratio for the four drummers as a function of tempo.

jmbylsma 5y ago
Any chance you could post another link or the title of the paper? citeseerx.ist.psu.edu appears to be at least temporarily offline.
- yesenadam 5y ago
  Oh sorry, it's Preferred swing ratio in jazz as a function of tempo, by Anders Friberg and Andreas Sundström. Here's another PDF link: https://www.diva-portal.org/smash/get/diva2:1246291/DATASET01 https://www.diva-portal.org/smash/get/diva2:1246291/DATASET0...
  - jmbylsma 5y ago
    Thank you!