6 ms·

When rights agreements were set up nobody could conceive of the idea of streaming. Unfortunately the BBC do not always own all the rights to broadcast something

When rights agreements were set up nobody could conceive of the idea of streaming. Unfortunately the BBC do not always own all the rights to broadcast something, and I can imagine it's basically impossible to retroactively untangle that. You're painting them as fools, while you're really playing Captain Hindsight.

tpmx 5y ago
After 1996 streaming became obvious because of Realnetworks. Are BBC news brodcasts playable from back then?
- afavour 5y ago
  How many Realnetworks streams from 1996 are playable today? I’d wager not many. By 1996 it was obvious that streaming video was technically possible. I don’t think it was anywhere near as obvious that it would become a cultural force to the extent that it has, nor that archiving such streams was particularly important. Not to mention the monetary angle: such deals would have cost the BBC more money and I’m not sure the majority of the population would have seen it as a worthy use of money at the time.
  - tpmx 5y ago
    Audio, not video. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RealAudio https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RealAudio
- chrisseaton 5y ago
  Where can I find these streams now? You're talking about people finding out that streaming was technically possible, not that society would adopt it as the way to distribute content in the future.
  - tpmx 5y ago
    > Where can I find these streams now? I'm asking the exact same thing. For some reason at least the European national tax/license-paid broadcasters that I have direct knowledge of only serve a very small portion of their back catalog. Even when there are no third parties to worry about.
    - chrisseaton 5y ago
      > I'm asking the exact same thing. Lol well then why give it an example of the BBC backward if nobody else was doing it? Nobody else had a time machine either. Why are you giving them a hard time over it?
      - tpmx 5y ago
        I'm giving European national radio broadcasters in general a hard time because the have chosen not to prioritize public access to old radio broadcasts that the public in those countries already paid for. There is a clear pattern that simply does not make sense (unless there's systematic corruption or mismanagement).
        chrisseaton 5y ago
        > that the public in those countries already paid for But they presumably didn't pay for streaming rights and for contracts with streaming residuals - isn't that the point? Isn't that the whole problem? Otherwise... they'd be streaming them.
        tpmx 5y ago
        That's what I've been trying to say. Most radio programs made by European national broadcasters are fully financed by themselves. Programs containing music is a separate story, of course. Nevertheless, I've haven't seen a European broadcaster that has a reasonable ~20 year archive of their own news/political analysis/etc shows online. (Perhaps one exists, though?) They point is that they have had 20+ years to figure this out, and they typically haven't. My understanding is that this kind of content is available for a year and then removed.
- timthorn 5y ago
  In 1996, almost everyone in the UK was still on dialup. Real videos typically resulted in significant latency for a not great quality image. As such, streaming wasn't obvious at that time, at least as a ubiquitous access medium.
  - tpmx 5y ago
    (Audio, not video. Doesn't anyone remember that Realnetworks only did audio at first?) Okay, let's say that high audio quality (mp3 128 kbps) audio streaming wasn't obvious until the year 2000. Surely after year 2000 all of the rights must have been worked out and all of the radio shows were properly stored and served for public on-demand consumption? Nope.
ectopod 5y ago
> Unfortunately the BBC do not always own all the rights to broadcast something This is not something that happened by accident. For the last thirty years governments of all stripes have been forcing the BBC to outsource more and more of their production to independent companies. The BBC (or rather me and you) pay for the production and the production company keeps the rights. When the government recently forced the BBC to publish presenter salaries, they then complained that much of the information they wanted was out of their reach because the programmes were made by independent companies. No shit!
- chrisseaton 5y ago
  Even if the BBC made absolutely everything in-house they still would have contracts with individual performers and other talent that would have residuals that would have to be negotiated for 'streaming' as a concept.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
- timthorn 5y ago
  Even where the BBC produces the programme itself, they can be prevented from streaming if they have included music where streaming rights weren't negotiated. Micro Men is a brilliant docudrama about the 80s home computer wars in the UK but because of its soundtrack won't even make it to DVD, let alone streaming.
  - ratsforhorses 5y ago
    Thanks for the reference googling I found https://youtu.be/XXBxV6-zamM https://youtu.be/XXBxV6-zamM

tpmx 5y ago

After 1996 streaming became obvious because of Realnetworks. Are BBC news brodcasts playable from back then?

afavour 5y ago
How many Realnetworks streams from 1996 are playable today? I’d wager not many. By 1996 it was obvious that streaming video was technically possible. I don’t think it was anywhere near as obvious that it would become a cultural force to the extent that it has, nor that archiving such streams was particularly important. Not to mention the monetary angle: such deals would have cost the BBC more money and I’m not sure the majority of the population would have seen it as a worthy use of money at the time.
- tpmx 5y ago
  Audio, not video. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RealAudio https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RealAudio
chrisseaton 5y ago
Where can I find these streams now? You're talking about people finding out that streaming was technically possible, not that society would adopt it as the way to distribute content in the future.
- tpmx 5y ago
  > Where can I find these streams now? I'm asking the exact same thing. For some reason at least the European national tax/license-paid broadcasters that I have direct knowledge of only serve a very small portion of their back catalog. Even when there are no third parties to worry about.
  - chrisseaton 5y ago
    > I'm asking the exact same thing. Lol well then why give it an example of the BBC backward if nobody else was doing it? Nobody else had a time machine either. Why are you giving them a hard time over it?
    - tpmx 5y ago
      I'm giving European national radio broadcasters in general a hard time because the have chosen not to prioritize public access to old radio broadcasts that the public in those countries already paid for. There is a clear pattern that simply does not make sense (unless there's systematic corruption or mismanagement).
      - chrisseaton 5y ago
        > that the public in those countries already paid for But they presumably didn't pay for streaming rights and for contracts with streaming residuals - isn't that the point? Isn't that the whole problem? Otherwise... they'd be streaming them.
        tpmx 5y ago
        That's what I've been trying to say. Most radio programs made by European national broadcasters are fully financed by themselves. Programs containing music is a separate story, of course. Nevertheless, I've haven't seen a European broadcaster that has a reasonable ~20 year archive of their own news/political analysis/etc shows online. (Perhaps one exists, though?) They point is that they have had 20+ years to figure this out, and they typically haven't. My understanding is that this kind of content is available for a year and then removed.
timthorn 5y ago
In 1996, almost everyone in the UK was still on dialup. Real videos typically resulted in significant latency for a not great quality image. As such, streaming wasn't obvious at that time, at least as a ubiquitous access medium.
- tpmx 5y ago
  (Audio, not video. Doesn't anyone remember that Realnetworks only did audio at first?) Okay, let's say that high audio quality (mp3 128 kbps) audio streaming wasn't obvious until the year 2000. Surely after year 2000 all of the rights must have been worked out and all of the radio shows were properly stored and served for public on-demand consumption? Nope.

ectopod 5y ago

> Unfortunately the BBC do not always own all the rights to broadcast something This is not something that happened by accident. For the last thirty years governments of all stripes have been forcing the BBC to outsource more and more of their production to independent companies. The BBC (or rather me and you) pay for the production and the production company keeps the rights. When the government recently forced the BBC to publish presenter salaries, they then complained that much of the information they wanted was out of their reach because the programmes were made by independent companies. No shit!

chrisseaton 5y ago
Even if the BBC made absolutely everything in-house they still would have contracts with individual performers and other talent that would have residuals that would have to be negotiated for 'streaming' as a concept.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
timthorn 5y ago
Even where the BBC produces the programme itself, they can be prevented from streaming if they have included music where streaming rights weren't negotiated. Micro Men is a brilliant docudrama about the 80s home computer wars in the UK but because of its soundtrack won't even make it to DVD, let alone streaming.
- ratsforhorses 5y ago
  Thanks for the reference googling I found https://youtu.be/XXBxV6-zamM https://youtu.be/XXBxV6-zamM