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English commentators have been extremely exercised about 'wokeness' recently, to the extent of setting up a news TV channel to push back https://en.wikipedia.or

English commentators have been extremely exercised about 'wokeness' recently, to the extent of setting up a news TV channel to push back https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GB_News https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GB_News Although positioned as a recent development, in reality this is absolutely nothing remotely new. The same class of commentators have been railing against 'PC gone mad' for decades. It's the same mix of fear of change and chinese-whispered 'you couldn't make it up' urban legends e.g. Baa Baa Green Sheep and Banning Christmas.

LatteLazy 5y ago
Fyi, the founders of GB news are both Americans. Its an American import. I am sure there is a market for it sadly. But don't lump that bs on us English please :) Linkedin: https://uk.linkedin.com/in/mark-schneider-12b4927 https://uk.linkedin.com/in/mark-schneider-12b4927 (moved over to run it) https://www.linkedin.com/in/andrewjamescole https://www.linkedin.com/in/andrewjamescole (still in the States). I think its important to recognise that all these groups, from GB news to the brexit campaign are NOT ground swells of public opinion. They're moneied interests, often foreign, using cash to change politics and bypass democracy...
- gadders 5y ago
  >>brexit campaign are NOT ground swells of public opinion There was a referendum recently that proved you wrong. Perhaps reflecting on why the EU was so unpopular would be more productive than blaming fictional foreign interests and low information voters.
  - soco 5y ago
    As it happened, the foreign interest were properly documented in the parliamentary "The Russia Report" of 2020 (and not only). I don't think we can ignore any of this in good faith.
    - gadders 5y ago
      The response to that report said that "We have seen no evidence of successful interference in the EU Referendum."
      - celticninja 5y ago
        yet Boris is selling seats in the House of Lords to Russians and they tried to stop the release of the report. So to assume they didnt have a hand in editing the findings is perhaps putting too much faith in the UK government. And right now, any, is too much.
        phpnode 5y ago
        let's not humour that guy by using his stage name
  - LatteLazy 5y ago
    Actually, it makes my point: the whole Leave campaign was foreign funded, filled with lies and controlled by rich right wing interests. And it worked. Decades of fake news about the bendiness of bananas, pushed by loss making media made enormous numbers of people honestly believe the EU wanted to eat their babies...
    - gadders 5y ago
      >> the whole Leave campaign was foreign funded, filled with lies and controlled by rich right wing interests And yet it had the whole mechanism of a right wing government working against it. So to summarise your position: Vote goes your way: This is the authentic will of the people Vote doesn't go your way: Obviously this was caused by big business and foreign interests.
      - LatteLazy 5y ago
        >And yet it had the whole mechanism of a right wing government working against it. No it didn't. The only reason the vote was called was because the majority of that government demanded it. The current Conservative PM campaigned for it. There are a long list of senior tory party members who pushed it, dozens of former ministers etc. >So to summarise your position Please don't strawman my position for me. Fyi, I have no problem admitting Bojo won fair and square despite thinking he's a disgrace.
        gadders 5y ago
        >>No it didn't. The only reason the vote was called was because the majority of that government demanded it. The current Conservative PM campaigned for it. There are a long list of senior tory party members who pushed it, dozens of former ministers etc. And yet the Conservative Prime Minister at the time campaigned against it, and even got the UK Government to send out a leaflet to every household in the UK advising to vote remain: https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/515068/why-the-government-believes-that-voting-to-remain-in-the-european-union-is-the-best-decision-for-the-uk.pdf https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/...
dash2 5y ago
"Woke" has become an annoying catchphrase. However, the underlying phenomenon is all too real, as a glance at https://www.thefire.org https://www.thefire.org, which is a non-partisan organization, will show you. I've certainly seen plenty of creepy, authoritarian speech-policing.
heurisko 5y ago
I have watched a bit of GB News, it was fairly unremarkable. I have seen a strong response to them by a group "Stop Funding Hate" who have put pressure on advertisers to boycott the channel. Given how little time the channel has been running, and that it includes former BBC presenters such as Andrew Neil, I find this fairly censorious. If they abide by the rules by Ofcom, where they are required to maintain "due impartiality", I don't mind if people want to talk and investigate what is important to them.
- feintruled 5y ago
  I don't mind either, it's fairly tame stuff. But ultimately it's yet another outlet banging on about 'wokeness', despite the fact they say there is too much of that. In fact I suspect they'll have their own brand of woke and cancel culture. They'll boycott Ikea for pulling their ads, and cancel people who don't wear poppies.
  - heurisko 5y ago
    Is your criticism about GB News, that you think "woke" debates are trivial, e.g. "Baa Baa Green Sheep and Banning Christmas"? Because it seems there is more to it than that, as some people, after all, want to bankrupt them on the account they are spreading hatred. If they are occupied by trivial matters, then why are they attracting such a strong backlash?
  - thu2111 5y ago
    You appear to be finding GBN guilty of something they: a. Haven't done b. Are strongly against ... on the belief that wokeness and cancel culture is nothing beyond generic "fear of change", despite the fact that they were on air less than 72 hours before a malicious radical left organization started trying to destroy them completely by lying to their advertisers. IKEA has by the way now recognized that they were lied to. That seems like a pretty large mis-understanding of the situation. When people rail against wokeness and cancel culture, they mean things like this.
- teh_klev 5y ago
  > I find this fairly censorious. Advertisers withdrawing their custom isn't censorship. GB News can still remain on air if they find some other source of funding.
loopz 5y ago
Stop feeding either "side". We have more pressing issues, like accellerating temperature trapping in earth's biodome. It's crisis time and both "sides" are loosing.

LatteLazy 5y ago

Fyi, the founders of GB news are both Americans. Its an American import. I am sure there is a market for it sadly. But don't lump that bs on us English please :) Linkedin: https://uk.linkedin.com/in/mark-schneider-12b4927 https://uk.linkedin.com/in/mark-schneider-12b4927 (moved over to run it) https://www.linkedin.com/in/andrewjamescole https://www.linkedin.com/in/andrewjamescole (still in the States). I think its important to recognise that all these groups, from GB news to the brexit campaign are NOT ground swells of public opinion. They're moneied interests, often foreign, using cash to change politics and bypass democracy...

gadders 5y ago
>>brexit campaign are NOT ground swells of public opinion There was a referendum recently that proved you wrong. Perhaps reflecting on why the EU was so unpopular would be more productive than blaming fictional foreign interests and low information voters.
- soco 5y ago
  As it happened, the foreign interest were properly documented in the parliamentary "The Russia Report" of 2020 (and not only). I don't think we can ignore any of this in good faith.
  - gadders 5y ago
    The response to that report said that "We have seen no evidence of successful interference in the EU Referendum."
    - celticninja 5y ago
      yet Boris is selling seats in the House of Lords to Russians and they tried to stop the release of the report. So to assume they didnt have a hand in editing the findings is perhaps putting too much faith in the UK government. And right now, any, is too much.
      - phpnode 5y ago
        let's not humour that guy by using his stage name
- LatteLazy 5y ago
  Actually, it makes my point: the whole Leave campaign was foreign funded, filled with lies and controlled by rich right wing interests. And it worked. Decades of fake news about the bendiness of bananas, pushed by loss making media made enormous numbers of people honestly believe the EU wanted to eat their babies...
  - gadders 5y ago
    >> the whole Leave campaign was foreign funded, filled with lies and controlled by rich right wing interests And yet it had the whole mechanism of a right wing government working against it. So to summarise your position: Vote goes your way: This is the authentic will of the people Vote doesn't go your way: Obviously this was caused by big business and foreign interests.
    - LatteLazy 5y ago
      >And yet it had the whole mechanism of a right wing government working against it. No it didn't. The only reason the vote was called was because the majority of that government demanded it. The current Conservative PM campaigned for it. There are a long list of senior tory party members who pushed it, dozens of former ministers etc. >So to summarise your position Please don't strawman my position for me. Fyi, I have no problem admitting Bojo won fair and square despite thinking he's a disgrace.
      - gadders 5y ago
        >>No it didn't. The only reason the vote was called was because the majority of that government demanded it. The current Conservative PM campaigned for it. There are a long list of senior tory party members who pushed it, dozens of former ministers etc. And yet the Conservative Prime Minister at the time campaigned against it, and even got the UK Government to send out a leaflet to every household in the UK advising to vote remain: https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/515068/why-the-government-believes-that-voting-to-remain-in-the-european-union-is-the-best-decision-for-the-uk.pdf https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/...

dash2 5y ago

"Woke" has become an annoying catchphrase. However, the underlying phenomenon is all too real, as a glance at https://www.thefire.org https://www.thefire.org, which is a non-partisan organization, will show you. I've certainly seen plenty of creepy, authoritarian speech-policing.

heurisko 5y ago

I have watched a bit of GB News, it was fairly unremarkable. I have seen a strong response to them by a group "Stop Funding Hate" who have put pressure on advertisers to boycott the channel. Given how little time the channel has been running, and that it includes former BBC presenters such as Andrew Neil, I find this fairly censorious. If they abide by the rules by Ofcom, where they are required to maintain "due impartiality", I don't mind if people want to talk and investigate what is important to them.

feintruled 5y ago
I don't mind either, it's fairly tame stuff. But ultimately it's yet another outlet banging on about 'wokeness', despite the fact they say there is too much of that. In fact I suspect they'll have their own brand of woke and cancel culture. They'll boycott Ikea for pulling their ads, and cancel people who don't wear poppies.
- heurisko 5y ago
  Is your criticism about GB News, that you think "woke" debates are trivial, e.g. "Baa Baa Green Sheep and Banning Christmas"? Because it seems there is more to it than that, as some people, after all, want to bankrupt them on the account they are spreading hatred. If they are occupied by trivial matters, then why are they attracting such a strong backlash?
- thu2111 5y ago
  You appear to be finding GBN guilty of something they: a. Haven't done b. Are strongly against ... on the belief that wokeness and cancel culture is nothing beyond generic "fear of change", despite the fact that they were on air less than 72 hours before a malicious radical left organization started trying to destroy them completely by lying to their advertisers. IKEA has by the way now recognized that they were lied to. That seems like a pretty large mis-understanding of the situation. When people rail against wokeness and cancel culture, they mean things like this.
teh_klev 5y ago
> I find this fairly censorious. Advertisers withdrawing their custom isn't censorship. GB News can still remain on air if they find some other source of funding.

loopz 5y ago

Stop feeding either "side". We have more pressing issues, like accellerating temperature trapping in earth's biodome. It's crisis time and both "sides" are loosing.