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I don’t think a lot of these characterisations are fair. Chinese culture does elevate hard work, I think that could be a factor. 996 is a thing, but I’m not su

I don’t think a lot of these characterisations are fair. Chinese culture does elevate hard work, I think that could be a factor. 996 is a thing, but I’m not sure it exists across the entire workforce, it’s more a tech workforce culture, even then not ubiquitous. The copying trope is frustrating to keep seeing. Who did they copy the space station off? It’s just not true at all. Your point on privacy sounds closer to the truth. Culturally they view privacy differently to say American culture. I think this is more related to Chinese historically have always been socially/community minded, America by contrast has championed the individual. The humanitarian point is pure propaganda. The west does not fear condemnation… they literally invaded and occupied two countries, and committed war crimes in them (see Australia’s SAS involvement). Modern day Chinas closest resemblance to that is it’s forced take over off Hong Kong (20 years after it’s hand over, but it promised 50). It’s just not even in the same league of humanitarian breaches as “the west”

selfhoster11 5y ago
The humanitarian point is problematic, I will admit, but Chinese humanitarian violations are much more dangerous. They seek to set a precedent for an Orwellian nightmare across the whole world. As a citizen of an ex-communist country (who was thankfully born after that era), I am keenly aware of how dangerous an extensive surveillance, censorship and propaganda network can be. They stifle thought, and in China's case, I am afraid that this time it will work. They have the track record. The West (or let's face it, those keen to join in with the US militarily - and not all of the West participates) might have killed people, but China wants to kill independent thought. This is the one principle that I consider near-sacred. Without our free will*, what are we as a species? I know my view is extreme, but China is doing nothing to reassure the West that it's not actually planning on doing that. I did not mean to suggest that they are merely copying, on the contrary. My point is that they bootstrapped their own understanding and manufacturing of the technology, and then took it much further and in a different direction to the West. It's not a bad thing as such. It just means that they got the Western "tech tree" (for lack of a non-video game analogy), recognised the value of what they are holding, then made it their own and did honest work to build upon it. The same likely happened with the space station. Even if the current one is more Russian than Chinese in its design, you can be sure that this ratio will rapidly shrink in favour of Chinese designs and expertise. * Yes, I know there are debates about whether it's actually free. I'm talking about the apparent effect.
- trasz 5y ago
  I’d argue the scale of Orwellian surveillance is larger in the West, particularly in US, in the form of Google and Facebook.
- onethought 5y ago
  I don’t think they are trying to kill free thought. I’d agree they severely limit any anti-ccp or anti-establishment but the level of innovation happening in China is strong evidence that “free thought” is encouraged. Is Fox News, or the news media in general not just as much a threat to free thinking as an actual “propaganda department”.

selfhoster11 5y ago

The humanitarian point is problematic, I will admit, but Chinese humanitarian violations are much more dangerous. They seek to set a precedent for an Orwellian nightmare across the whole world. As a citizen of an ex-communist country (who was thankfully born after that era), I am keenly aware of how dangerous an extensive surveillance, censorship and propaganda network can be. They stifle thought, and in China's case, I am afraid that this time it will work. They have the track record. The West (or let's face it, those keen to join in with the US militarily - and not all of the West participates) might have killed people, but China wants to kill independent thought. This is the one principle that I consider near-sacred. Without our free will*, what are we as a species? I know my view is extreme, but China is doing nothing to reassure the West that it's not actually planning on doing that. I did not mean to suggest that they are merely copying, on the contrary. My point is that they bootstrapped their own understanding and manufacturing of the technology, and then took it much further and in a different direction to the West. It's not a bad thing as such. It just means that they got the Western "tech tree" (for lack of a non-video game analogy), recognised the value of what they are holding, then made it their own and did honest work to build upon it. The same likely happened with the space station. Even if the current one is more Russian than Chinese in its design, you can be sure that this ratio will rapidly shrink in favour of Chinese designs and expertise. * Yes, I know there are debates about whether it's actually free. I'm talking about the apparent effect.

trasz 5y ago
I’d argue the scale of Orwellian surveillance is larger in the West, particularly in US, in the form of Google and Facebook.
onethought 5y ago
I don’t think they are trying to kill free thought. I’d agree they severely limit any anti-ccp or anti-establishment but the level of innovation happening in China is strong evidence that “free thought” is encouraged. Is Fox News, or the news media in general not just as much a threat to free thinking as an actual “propaganda department”.