4 ms·

Created a lot of jobs in the industry of arresting and detaining humans. Being number 1 per capita in prison population isn't a lean operation, a lot of people

Created a lot of jobs in the industry of arresting and detaining humans. Being number 1 per capita in prison population isn't a lean operation, a lot of people's lives depend on the system continuing. I think the solution is to rent bulldozers, armor them, and just level a bunch of them. Too many prison beds, too many laws, it's all gotten very dumb.

tyingq 5y ago
It's pretty hard to get info on the industry as well. Jpay, for example, is a subsidiary of a private company, and does the "fund a prisoners commissary account" as well as "send a prisoner a email" type services. Here's their fees for money transfers for the Texas Prisoners: $ 0.00 - 9.99 $2.45 $ 10.00 - 19.99 $3.45 $ 20.00 - 49.99 $6.45 $ 50.00 - 99.99 $8.45 $ 100.00 - 199.99 $10.45 $ 200.00 - 300.00 $12.45 They also charge it as a cash advance, which can result in additional charges from your bank. Ouch.
20after4 5y ago
killdozer style?
- pope_meat 5y ago
  Yes, and soon before all the heavy machinery has kill switches mandated in them. xD I suspect that weakness will be shored up as we internet of things every car truck and pogo stick.
  - kbenson 5y ago
    But all that's just what those machines are waiting for. Did we learn nothing from Maximum Overdrive?
ppeetteerr 5y ago
And so many episodes of Brooklyn Nine-nine
- pope_meat 5y ago
  Copaganda was very funny. I laughed and related to our heroes in blue. Funny they don't seem to shoot unarmed kids in the show at all, wish our cops took inspiration.
MuffinFlavored 5y ago
> Created a lot of jobs in the industry of arresting and detaining humans. What portion of those arrested + detained are the type of people we want in society/civilization?
- pope_meat 5y ago
  A large portion, in my opinion. You can disagree.
- tetranomiga 5y ago
  A huge portion of them, considering just how much of our prison system is filled with first-time non-violent offenders. Also considering the socioeconomic effects of even a misdemeanor drug conviction at a young age, a lot more career criminals could've been prevented by not sending them to prison in the first place.
- ARandumGuy 5y ago
  Probably a sizable number of them. Because the people in prison are still people, and there's no good reason to keep most of them locked in a cage if they're not posing a risk to other people.
- tyingq 5y ago
  >What portion of those arrested + detained are the type of people we want in society/civilization? Check a list of countries by rate of incarceration[1]. Then ask yourself if it's likely that the US, El Salvador, Turkmenistan, Palau and Rwanda are the grouping that have it right. That's the top 5, in order, all at 511+ per 100k. For comparison, Australia is 160, England is 130, Canada is 104, France is at 93, etc. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_incarceration_rate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_incarcera... Edit: Generally, I read all that as "probably 3 or 4 of every 5 US prisoners don't need to be in prison".
  - asdff 5y ago
    Part of that is a side effect of poor public health policy in the U.S., where mentally ill and addicted either end up in jail or in a tent on the street instead of in a treatment center or an asylum like these other first world countries.
jkestner 5y ago
Let's start with the prisons about to be built, of which there are still many. A campaign to convince the Travis County (Austin) commissioners not to fund a new $80M women's prison succeeded this week. Next step is to get them to instead fund diversion and mental health programs. You may find similar movements that you can join in pressuring local officials. The fun thing is that at this level of government, commissioners will often respond themselves, so you know even relatively few emails are making an impact.
- pope_meat 5y ago
  While a good thing, a losing battle in my opinion. You can perhaps convince your local authorities to not build another prison here this year, but somewhere else another prison still got built. There isn't enough people who give a shit, and an alarming amount of people who are rock hard for cruel punishment as a good thing. Unbuild the existing prisons. John Brown didn't write letters, he burned down plantations.
  - iammisc 5y ago
    Are you advocating for the violent destruction of government property? Is that allowed on hacker news?
    - pope_meat 5y ago
      it doesn't have to be violent. structures feel nothing.
      - iammisc 5y ago
        So destroying public property is not violence now? Okay... thanks I guess.
        tikwidd 5y ago
        The US prison system is an ongoing act of violence. Destroying and replacing them with humane systems should reduce violence.
asdff 5y ago
Part of the reason why jails are overrun in recent years is that we've closed a large number of asylums who would have housed and treated these people. Sure, that sort of thing leaves a bad taste in the mouth, but psychological care has certainly advanced leaps and bounds past 1950s standards for mental illness and addiction treatment. There's no reason why we couldn't have effective asylums today like they have in Europe for their mentally ill and addicted.

tyingq 5y ago

It's pretty hard to get info on the industry as well. Jpay, for example, is a subsidiary of a private company, and does the "fund a prisoners commissary account" as well as "send a prisoner a email" type services. Here's their fees for money transfers for the Texas Prisoners: $ 0.00 - 9.99 $2.45 $ 10.00 - 19.99 $3.45 $ 20.00 - 49.99 $6.45 $ 50.00 - 99.99 $8.45 $ 100.00 - 199.99 $10.45 $ 200.00 - 300.00 $12.45 They also charge it as a cash advance, which can result in additional charges from your bank. Ouch.

20after4 5y ago

killdozer style?

pope_meat 5y ago
Yes, and soon before all the heavy machinery has kill switches mandated in them. xD I suspect that weakness will be shored up as we internet of things every car truck and pogo stick.
- kbenson 5y ago
  But all that's just what those machines are waiting for. Did we learn nothing from Maximum Overdrive?

ppeetteerr 5y ago

And so many episodes of Brooklyn Nine-nine

pope_meat 5y ago
Copaganda was very funny. I laughed and related to our heroes in blue. Funny they don't seem to shoot unarmed kids in the show at all, wish our cops took inspiration.

MuffinFlavored 5y ago

> Created a lot of jobs in the industry of arresting and detaining humans. What portion of those arrested + detained are the type of people we want in society/civilization?

pope_meat 5y ago
A large portion, in my opinion. You can disagree.
tetranomiga 5y ago
A huge portion of them, considering just how much of our prison system is filled with first-time non-violent offenders. Also considering the socioeconomic effects of even a misdemeanor drug conviction at a young age, a lot more career criminals could've been prevented by not sending them to prison in the first place.
ARandumGuy 5y ago
Probably a sizable number of them. Because the people in prison are still people, and there's no good reason to keep most of them locked in a cage if they're not posing a risk to other people.
tyingq 5y ago
>What portion of those arrested + detained are the type of people we want in society/civilization? Check a list of countries by rate of incarceration[1]. Then ask yourself if it's likely that the US, El Salvador, Turkmenistan, Palau and Rwanda are the grouping that have it right. That's the top 5, in order, all at 511+ per 100k. For comparison, Australia is 160, England is 130, Canada is 104, France is at 93, etc. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_incarceration_rate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_incarcera... Edit: Generally, I read all that as "probably 3 or 4 of every 5 US prisoners don't need to be in prison".
- asdff 5y ago
  Part of that is a side effect of poor public health policy in the U.S., where mentally ill and addicted either end up in jail or in a tent on the street instead of in a treatment center or an asylum like these other first world countries.

jkestner 5y ago

Let's start with the prisons about to be built, of which there are still many. A campaign to convince the Travis County (Austin) commissioners not to fund a new $80M women's prison succeeded this week. Next step is to get them to instead fund diversion and mental health programs. You may find similar movements that you can join in pressuring local officials. The fun thing is that at this level of government, commissioners will often respond themselves, so you know even relatively few emails are making an impact.

pope_meat 5y ago
While a good thing, a losing battle in my opinion. You can perhaps convince your local authorities to not build another prison here this year, but somewhere else another prison still got built. There isn't enough people who give a shit, and an alarming amount of people who are rock hard for cruel punishment as a good thing. Unbuild the existing prisons. John Brown didn't write letters, he burned down plantations.
- iammisc 5y ago
  Are you advocating for the violent destruction of government property? Is that allowed on hacker news?
  - pope_meat 5y ago
    it doesn't have to be violent. structures feel nothing.
    - iammisc 5y ago
      So destroying public property is not violence now? Okay... thanks I guess.
      - tikwidd 5y ago
        The US prison system is an ongoing act of violence. Destroying and replacing them with humane systems should reduce violence.

asdff 5y ago

Part of the reason why jails are overrun in recent years is that we've closed a large number of asylums who would have housed and treated these people. Sure, that sort of thing leaves a bad taste in the mouth, but psychological care has certainly advanced leaps and bounds past 1950s standards for mental illness and addiction treatment. There's no reason why we couldn't have effective asylums today like they have in Europe for their mentally ill and addicted.