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That’s not true at all. Look at open source. Some of the most important software in the world was written when the devs were motivated to write it, not 9-5 m-f.

missedthecue 5y ago
An open source project isn't the same thing as a several thousand person corporation with not only engineers, but business analysts, legal departments, accounting, sales, client services, human resources, IT, management, and so on and so forth. Each has deadlines they have to abide by, some set by their bosses, some set by the government, and others implicitly imposed by competitors. That's much different than a pet project that's being given away for free.
- zingar 5y ago
  I don't think gp was unaware of those conditions at corporates, but rather suggests that the layers of management, meetings and deadlines make for worse software. Also remember that opens source includes things like the Linux kernel. That "pet" project underpins almost all software that the hypothetical corporate uses and makes, and does it without the meetings and the deadlines.
regularfry 5y ago
Bear in mind that the modal Linux kernel dev is closer to a cubicle dweller than a basement dweller. For large, important projects it absolutely is 9-5.
Andrew_nenakhov 5y ago
Most of the open source developers who created 'most important software in the world' were paid to do it. There are very few oss projects that were developed only by volunteers.
- luffapi 5y ago
  I think Linus and 90% of GitHub projects would disagree.
  - Andrew_nenakhov 5y ago
    You should probably do some research about Linus net worth. He has been employed to work on kernel for a few decades. And if we are talking about some of the most important software projects, approx. zero of them are run by hobbyists. Some niche aplications - sure. But not the most important pieces. (Disclosure: for the last few years I employ 4-8 people to work on GNU GPL licensed products, so I know a thing or two about how it works)
    - luffapi 5y ago
      Do you really think Linus works 9-5? I assure you he doesn’t. I’ve also developed and led teams that developed many OSS projects and very successful consumer applications. Not once did I micromanage my team’s working hours. They make their own schedules as people know best when they can produce good output.
      - deleted 5y ago
        [deleted]
      - Andrew_nenakhov 5y ago
        Linus is very disciplined, so yeah, he likely does work 9-5, like most organized people with a family do. As for 'micromanaging working hours', it's not a question of micromanagement, but of communication. It is far easier for everyone to work in the same rythm, knowing that you aren't distracting a person you need to contact from his private life.
ChrisLomont 5y ago
The biggest and widest used open source projects have billions in corporate investment in them. None were simply the product of devs working in off hours for free for fun.

missedthecue 5y ago

An open source project isn't the same thing as a several thousand person corporation with not only engineers, but business analysts, legal departments, accounting, sales, client services, human resources, IT, management, and so on and so forth. Each has deadlines they have to abide by, some set by their bosses, some set by the government, and others implicitly imposed by competitors. That's much different than a pet project that's being given away for free.

zingar 5y ago
I don't think gp was unaware of those conditions at corporates, but rather suggests that the layers of management, meetings and deadlines make for worse software. Also remember that opens source includes things like the Linux kernel. That "pet" project underpins almost all software that the hypothetical corporate uses and makes, and does it without the meetings and the deadlines.

regularfry 5y ago

Bear in mind that the modal Linux kernel dev is closer to a cubicle dweller than a basement dweller. For large, important projects it absolutely is 9-5.

Andrew_nenakhov 5y ago

Most of the open source developers who created 'most important software in the world' were paid to do it. There are very few oss projects that were developed only by volunteers.

luffapi 5y ago
I think Linus and 90% of GitHub projects would disagree.
- Andrew_nenakhov 5y ago
  You should probably do some research about Linus net worth. He has been employed to work on kernel for a few decades. And if we are talking about some of the most important software projects, approx. zero of them are run by hobbyists. Some niche aplications - sure. But not the most important pieces. (Disclosure: for the last few years I employ 4-8 people to work on GNU GPL licensed products, so I know a thing or two about how it works)
  - luffapi 5y ago
    Do you really think Linus works 9-5? I assure you he doesn’t. I’ve also developed and led teams that developed many OSS projects and very successful consumer applications. Not once did I micromanage my team’s working hours. They make their own schedules as people know best when they can produce good output.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
    - Andrew_nenakhov 5y ago
      Linus is very disciplined, so yeah, he likely does work 9-5, like most organized people with a family do. As for 'micromanaging working hours', it's not a question of micromanagement, but of communication. It is far easier for everyone to work in the same rythm, knowing that you aren't distracting a person you need to contact from his private life.

ChrisLomont 5y ago

The biggest and widest used open source projects have billions in corporate investment in them. None were simply the product of devs working in off hours for free for fun.