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I've been saying this, almost to the exact letter, for the last 13 years. Not the "college is a waste of time" part, but the part about "we need to divorce the

by Eliezer 18y ago

I've been saying this, almost to the exact letter, for the last 13 years. Not the "college is a waste of time" part, but the part about "we need to divorce the skill verification from the skill teaching".

krschultz 18y ago
That I agree with, but truthfully it is already there. CPA exam, professional engineer exam, bar exam, medical exams. What doesn't have an exam? Marketing, sales? There is a PE exam for computer engineering/science but no one takes it. Just push people to take them and it will accomplish the same thing.
- yummyfajitas 18y ago
  >What doesn't have an exam? Entry level office job. B.A. or B.S. required. It would be nice to have a GEBA, just like we have a GED. Additionally, you can't take many of the exams you just mentioned without a degree. I.e. the degree and the exams are still married, the exam is just standardized.
- bokonist 18y ago
  It's not there because all those professional guilds legally require a college degree. It used to be you could just pass the bar and become a lawyer. The bar associations then got laws passed requiring an actual law degrees, so people took inexpensive correspondence courses. The lawyers then fought back by requiring the schools be accredited, and setting minimum rules for face time. Thus you are forced to pay very expensive law school tuition to practice as a lawyer. This pushes up the wages of the current lawyers, who got the law passed. The whole thing is a scam.
  - krschultz 18y ago
    Is it a scam? Do you really want people to be able to get engineering degrees without going through the rigour of a full college education? These are the people who design airplanes and cars and powerplants. Sure maybe it works for Java programming of some BS business app, but most of the exams out there are on fields where screwing up something has major consequences.
    - bokonist 18y ago
      That's what the test is for. In a law it's a scam because requiring professors that teach in person has absolutely nothing to do with learning law. You learn law from studying books and then practicing (apprenticeship). Not from professors. The same is true with almost all professions.
    - BrandonM 18y ago
      You actually think someone who went through "the rigour of a full college education" is any less likely to screw up than someone who passed a certification exam? I know plenty of people who coasted through a CS&E degree (Computer Science and Engineering) at my school, and I'm not sure I'd want them writing the software for "airplanes and cars and powerplants". The point is that a degree doesn't prove much, and a certification can prove approximately as much at a significantly lower cost.

by Eliezer 18y ago

krschultz 18y ago

That I agree with, but truthfully it is already there. CPA exam, professional engineer exam, bar exam, medical exams. What doesn't have an exam? Marketing, sales? There is a PE exam for computer engineering/science but no one takes it. Just push people to take them and it will accomplish the same thing.

yummyfajitas 18y ago
>What doesn't have an exam? Entry level office job. B.A. or B.S. required. It would be nice to have a GEBA, just like we have a GED. Additionally, you can't take many of the exams you just mentioned without a degree. I.e. the degree and the exams are still married, the exam is just standardized.
bokonist 18y ago
It's not there because all those professional guilds legally require a college degree. It used to be you could just pass the bar and become a lawyer. The bar associations then got laws passed requiring an actual law degrees, so people took inexpensive correspondence courses. The lawyers then fought back by requiring the schools be accredited, and setting minimum rules for face time. Thus you are forced to pay very expensive law school tuition to practice as a lawyer. This pushes up the wages of the current lawyers, who got the law passed. The whole thing is a scam.
- krschultz 18y ago
  Is it a scam? Do you really want people to be able to get engineering degrees without going through the rigour of a full college education? These are the people who design airplanes and cars and powerplants. Sure maybe it works for Java programming of some BS business app, but most of the exams out there are on fields where screwing up something has major consequences.
  - bokonist 18y ago
    That's what the test is for. In a law it's a scam because requiring professors that teach in person has absolutely nothing to do with learning law. You learn law from studying books and then practicing (apprenticeship). Not from professors. The same is true with almost all professions.
  - BrandonM 18y ago
    You actually think someone who went through "the rigour of a full college education" is any less likely to screw up than someone who passed a certification exam? I know plenty of people who coasted through a CS&E degree (Computer Science and Engineering) at my school, and I'm not sure I'd want them writing the software for "airplanes and cars and powerplants". The point is that a degree doesn't prove much, and a certification can prove approximately as much at a significantly lower cost.