4 ms·

The price of groceries going up is a good thing?

BitwiseFool 5y ago
There's this weird dichotomy in Economics where what's good for "The Economy" is often bad for you, the individual. And vice versa. This isn't true for everything, of course, but I've definitely noticed it whenever you hear stories about inflation, the price of gas, wages going up, the dollar being 'strong', etc.
NikolaeVarius 5y ago
The value of debts also go down.
shakezula 5y ago
Yes, economically it likely is. Its your stagnating wages that are a bad thing. If wages had increased like they should've, then a few dollar increase in your groceries wouldn't be the issue that it is.
mullingitover 5y ago
Inflation means that wages go up along with the prices of groceries, so it's a wash. The only thing that suffers with inflation is a big pile of cash, which poor people don't have (they generally owe a big pile of cash, which inflation shrinks for them). The people trying to scare everyone about inflation are the ones who the poor people owe the big pile of cash, and they have a very large megaphone.
- mindslight 5y ago
  Poor people don't have standing debts but rather revolving ones, and so their debt scales with inflation. The rich don't have piles of cash, they buy assets instead. Inflation hoses the middle class who wants to save in cash, which is part of why the middle class is vanishing - extreme monetary inflation to counteract the ever-growing deflation inherent to technological progress.
  - mullingitover 5y ago
    > Inflation hoses the middle class who wants to save in cash Can you point me to some middle class people who are just sitting on a huge pile of cash? I'm a pretty standard middle class person and the vast majority of my net worth is tied up in a 401k, and if it wasn't there it'd be in a house that would be seriously outpacing inflation.
    - mindslight 5y ago
      A house and 401k are both illiquid and thus irrelevant to your economic bargaining power. If you're upper-middle class then sure your liquid funds might be in a brokerage account, but if you're lower-middle it's likely just a savings account where you're working on building an emergency fund.
      - mullingitover 5y ago
        I can get liquidity out of my 401k trivially by borrowing against it. A home equity loan takes a bit more time but it's also simple to do. If you're lower middle class you most likely don't have any money in your savings account at all[1], but you do have debt which gets diluted by inflation. Also, to your earlier point: > Poor people don't have standing debts but rather revolving ones, and so their debt scales with inflation. So at worst that's a wash. [1] https://abcnews.go.com/US/10-americans-struggle-cover-400-emergency-expense-federal/story?id=63253846 https://abcnews.go.com/US/10-americans-struggle-cover-400-em...
- lp0_on_fire 5y ago
  we have 40 years of data showing that wages _haven't_ been keeping up with inflation.
  - mullingitover 5y ago
    Nope, this has been brought up before and it's wrong. The data shows wages are not keeping up with productivity gains, they are actually flat with inflation. Now I agree having all the benefits from productivity gains going to the people who aren't working for them is some bullshit, but that's not the same as wages going down when you account for inflation.
- splitstud 5y ago
  Sweet summer child

There's this weird dichotomy in Economics where what's good for "The Economy" is often bad for you, the individual. And vice versa. This isn't true for everything, of course, but I've definitely noticed it whenever you hear stories about inflation, the price of gas, wages going up, the dollar being 'strong', etc.

NikolaeVarius 5y ago

The value of debts also go down.

shakezula 5y ago

Yes, economically it likely is. Its your stagnating wages that are a bad thing. If wages had increased like they should've, then a few dollar increase in your groceries wouldn't be the issue that it is.

mullingitover 5y ago

Inflation means that wages go up along with the prices of groceries, so it's a wash. The only thing that suffers with inflation is a big pile of cash, which poor people don't have (they generally owe a big pile of cash, which inflation shrinks for them). The people trying to scare everyone about inflation are the ones who the poor people owe the big pile of cash, and they have a very large megaphone.

mindslight 5y ago
Poor people don't have standing debts but rather revolving ones, and so their debt scales with inflation. The rich don't have piles of cash, they buy assets instead. Inflation hoses the middle class who wants to save in cash, which is part of why the middle class is vanishing - extreme monetary inflation to counteract the ever-growing deflation inherent to technological progress.
- mullingitover 5y ago
  > Inflation hoses the middle class who wants to save in cash Can you point me to some middle class people who are just sitting on a huge pile of cash? I'm a pretty standard middle class person and the vast majority of my net worth is tied up in a 401k, and if it wasn't there it'd be in a house that would be seriously outpacing inflation.
  - mindslight 5y ago
    A house and 401k are both illiquid and thus irrelevant to your economic bargaining power. If you're upper-middle class then sure your liquid funds might be in a brokerage account, but if you're lower-middle it's likely just a savings account where you're working on building an emergency fund.
    - mullingitover 5y ago
      I can get liquidity out of my 401k trivially by borrowing against it. A home equity loan takes a bit more time but it's also simple to do. If you're lower middle class you most likely don't have any money in your savings account at all[1], but you do have debt which gets diluted by inflation. Also, to your earlier point: > Poor people don't have standing debts but rather revolving ones, and so their debt scales with inflation. So at worst that's a wash. [1] https://abcnews.go.com/US/10-americans-struggle-cover-400-emergency-expense-federal/story?id=63253846 https://abcnews.go.com/US/10-americans-struggle-cover-400-em...
lp0_on_fire 5y ago
we have 40 years of data showing that wages _haven't_ been keeping up with inflation.
- mullingitover 5y ago
  Nope, this has been brought up before and it's wrong. The data shows wages are not keeping up with productivity gains, they are actually flat with inflation. Now I agree having all the benefits from productivity gains going to the people who aren't working for them is some bullshit, but that's not the same as wages going down when you account for inflation.
splitstud 5y ago
Sweet summer child