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I would have more acceptance towards this viewpoint if it was about automatic positioning using images of the neighborhood. To me, lamenting the era of wifi te

I would have more acceptance towards this viewpoint if it was about automatic positioning using images of the neighborhood. To me, lamenting the era of wifi technology yet without ubiquitous use of smartphones seems a bit... quaint?

rootusrootus 5y ago
I think we should raise the issue repeatedly until we reach an informed consensus (apathy doesn't count as consensus IMO) as to how we handle information in the digital age. So much of our legal system is founded on principles that made sense not that long ago but are upended by the recent emergence of trivial mass data collection possible with current technology. We need to have a conversation about what is a sensible policy, and not just on tech forums.
- yesbabyyes 5y ago
  To be sure, I agree with your general standpoint here. I just couldn't resist when the argument is based on the somewhat random convenience of broadcasting an (often user selected) id of your network, while simultaneously holding that nobody is allowed to keep track of that id. To be clear, I don't, at all, think this is a workable path forward. I also wanted to point out how brief a period of time this is. Imagine learning about some issue arising from movable type in the 15th century, being solved over a period of a few decades, helping the rise of some corporation/feudality long past. When it comes to policy, how about making APs not broadcasting a public id, while making it illegal to track any traffic on any identifiers for the spectrum? Would that be called for? Or does the convenience of setting up a new AP make up for the fact that a corporation may make a few more bucks out of an improved positioning service? I don't know, but I still find it funny that you would defend a particular decade in the early noughts, holding these few years as an ideal.
  - rootusrootus 5y ago
    > still find it funny that you would defend a particular decade in the early noughts If I came across that way, it was unintentional. I appreciate the counterpoints to my comments, especially the thoughtful ones like yours. I think I don't really come to HN to convince anybody else of my opinion, but rather to convince myself that I have given my position a decent amount of consideration. The more I have to defend my thoughts, the clearer they become. To me, at least ;-) For policy, I think we should make data PI data collection transparent to the targeted person. Just like I have the legal right to see collected information in my credit file, I think that legislation should be expanded so that it applies to other forms of data collected about citizens by private companies. Everything from Best Buy's contract with a private company that keeps a 'refund score' (I don't recall what it is actually called specifically) on each customer which it then uses to determine whether or not to reject their product return, to this kind of 'public' data collection Google is engaging in. In some ways the horse has already left the barn, and there is already a serious amount of data which has been collected, but I hope that before it gets used for nefarious reasons we can figure out how to muzzle it. We need a clear definition of what constitutes my data, and public data, which is adapted for modern technology.

rootusrootus 5y ago

I think we should raise the issue repeatedly until we reach an informed consensus (apathy doesn't count as consensus IMO) as to how we handle information in the digital age. So much of our legal system is founded on principles that made sense not that long ago but are upended by the recent emergence of trivial mass data collection possible with current technology. We need to have a conversation about what is a sensible policy, and not just on tech forums.

yesbabyyes 5y ago
To be sure, I agree with your general standpoint here. I just couldn't resist when the argument is based on the somewhat random convenience of broadcasting an (often user selected) id of your network, while simultaneously holding that nobody is allowed to keep track of that id. To be clear, I don't, at all, think this is a workable path forward. I also wanted to point out how brief a period of time this is. Imagine learning about some issue arising from movable type in the 15th century, being solved over a period of a few decades, helping the rise of some corporation/feudality long past. When it comes to policy, how about making APs not broadcasting a public id, while making it illegal to track any traffic on any identifiers for the spectrum? Would that be called for? Or does the convenience of setting up a new AP make up for the fact that a corporation may make a few more bucks out of an improved positioning service? I don't know, but I still find it funny that you would defend a particular decade in the early noughts, holding these few years as an ideal.
- rootusrootus 5y ago
  > still find it funny that you would defend a particular decade in the early noughts If I came across that way, it was unintentional. I appreciate the counterpoints to my comments, especially the thoughtful ones like yours. I think I don't really come to HN to convince anybody else of my opinion, but rather to convince myself that I have given my position a decent amount of consideration. The more I have to defend my thoughts, the clearer they become. To me, at least ;-) For policy, I think we should make data PI data collection transparent to the targeted person. Just like I have the legal right to see collected information in my credit file, I think that legislation should be expanded so that it applies to other forms of data collected about citizens by private companies. Everything from Best Buy's contract with a private company that keeps a 'refund score' (I don't recall what it is actually called specifically) on each customer which it then uses to determine whether or not to reject their product return, to this kind of 'public' data collection Google is engaging in. In some ways the horse has already left the barn, and there is already a serious amount of data which has been collected, but I hope that before it gets used for nefarious reasons we can figure out how to muzzle it. We need a clear definition of what constitutes my data, and public data, which is adapted for modern technology.