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It's interesting. 12 years have passed, and I still prefer a native (not Electron) desktop app to its web equivalent for practically any task, from writing code

It's interesting. 12 years have passed, and I still prefer a native (not Electron) desktop app to its web equivalent for practically any task, from writing code to working with spreadsheets to PCB design. Even for such a basic task like word processing I prefer to use a local program rather than a web app.

mech422 5y ago
yeah - unfortunately, it gets harder to find native apps every year...
ho_schi 5y ago
Every Electron App teaches us a story, often stuff like "time to market" and "we cannot provide stable APIs" and "we don't pay your RAM" and "it is okay that it's slow and laggy".
mattbee 5y ago
Me too. But this rant still resonates and speaks to a snobbery that's still occasionally alive. I am surprised that high quality web apps still seem just as rare in 2021 as they did in 2009 despite the explosion of tools. i.e. apps that do something non-trivial, where the network usage disappears under "acceptable interaction time", where the UI toolkit is consistent & discoverable, where nothing is broken. But it's still true - if you want to program software that people use, it's using web technology or it's a video game or it's a tiny tiny niche.
- mattgreenrocks 5y ago
  Yeah. It almost feels like there's a ceiling on quality imposed by the platform. 60fps is still seen as an aspirational goal for webapps, and most apps we use everyday are just...okay. I've yet to use a webapp that I found truly inspiring in execution and design. I may just be a snob. It's possible, but most of the time it always feels like once you're starting to settle in and really use a webapp, the seams show themselves somehow: the browser hiccups, a server is slow, the React filler boxes linger for just too long. However, this doesn't really matter; the real goal of webapps is mostly to generate economic activity. In the past, this caused me some existential grief. I deal with it by simply avoiding any dev work related to the web. For my own projects, I stick to native apps. I think it says something when I choose putting up with Xcode vs developing for the web. :)
- BeFlatXIII 5y ago
  > if you want to program software that people use, it's using web technology or it's a video game or it's a tiny tiny niche. Or it’s a mobile app (though that can overlap with both video game and tiny niche if you want to make an app that covers all three bases at once).
  - mattbee 5y ago
    That's true - though most apps I use on my phone respond like like webviews.
bool3max 5y ago
Word processing is no simple task.
- dvfjsdhgfv 5y ago
  I agree, that's why I said "basic", not "simple". Basic in the sense that we had them for over half a century and everybody is using them. The amount of thought and engineering needed to build an efficient word processor still amazes me.

mech422 5y ago

yeah - unfortunately, it gets harder to find native apps every year...

ho_schi 5y ago

Every Electron App teaches us a story, often stuff like "time to market" and "we cannot provide stable APIs" and "we don't pay your RAM" and "it is okay that it's slow and laggy".

mattbee 5y ago

Me too. But this rant still resonates and speaks to a snobbery that's still occasionally alive. I am surprised that high quality web apps still seem just as rare in 2021 as they did in 2009 despite the explosion of tools. i.e. apps that do something non-trivial, where the network usage disappears under "acceptable interaction time", where the UI toolkit is consistent & discoverable, where nothing is broken. But it's still true - if you want to program software that people use, it's using web technology or it's a video game or it's a tiny tiny niche.

mattgreenrocks 5y ago
Yeah. It almost feels like there's a ceiling on quality imposed by the platform. 60fps is still seen as an aspirational goal for webapps, and most apps we use everyday are just...okay. I've yet to use a webapp that I found truly inspiring in execution and design. I may just be a snob. It's possible, but most of the time it always feels like once you're starting to settle in and really use a webapp, the seams show themselves somehow: the browser hiccups, a server is slow, the React filler boxes linger for just too long. However, this doesn't really matter; the real goal of webapps is mostly to generate economic activity. In the past, this caused me some existential grief. I deal with it by simply avoiding any dev work related to the web. For my own projects, I stick to native apps. I think it says something when I choose putting up with Xcode vs developing for the web. :)
BeFlatXIII 5y ago
> if you want to program software that people use, it's using web technology or it's a video game or it's a tiny tiny niche. Or it’s a mobile app (though that can overlap with both video game and tiny niche if you want to make an app that covers all three bases at once).
- mattbee 5y ago
  That's true - though most apps I use on my phone respond like like webviews.

bool3max 5y ago

Word processing is no simple task.

dvfjsdhgfv 5y ago
I agree, that's why I said "basic", not "simple". Basic in the sense that we had them for over half a century and everybody is using them. The amount of thought and engineering needed to build an efficient word processor still amazes me.