5 ms·
I want to point out that this is incorrect: > It’s rare to hear someone accused of being un-Swedish or un-British—but un-American is a common slur, slung by bo
by alkonaut 5y ago
I want to point out that this is incorrect:
> It’s rare to hear someone accused of being un-Swedish or un-British—but un-American is a common slur, slung by both left and right against the other. Being called un-American is like being called “un-Christian” or “un-Islamic,” a charge akin to heresy.
In fact to be unswedish is not just a common idiom it’s a positive one. It’s when you don’t show the typical negative Swedishness. You aren’t “accused” of it, you are congratulated.
“-I went to say hello to all the neighbors in my building. -What a nice and unswedish thing to do!”
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- 627467 5y agoIn my anecdotal experience, calling out "un-Nationality" seems way more common in the New World than the Old World and I wonder if this is still remnants of nation-building side effects.
- dstroot 5y agoAs an American I find being accused of being unAmerican is usually something I find humorous: 1) If you don't blow stuff up on 4th of of July you are unAmerican! 2) If you can't eat Hotdogs like Joey Chestnut you are unAmerican! 3) If you don't own gun you are...
- hilbertseries 5y agoSeems that British nationalism runs pretty deep too, no? How else would you explain brexit?
- skissane 5y agoMany would argue that Brexit was more about English nationalism than British nationalism. What makes the UK very complex is the coexistence of two layers of national identity – British layered over English, Scottish, Welsh, (Northern) Irish. Which layer a person identifies with is very often determined by their politics, and sometimes also by religious/cultural background. (British vs Irish identity in Northern Ireland tends to correspond with Protestant vs Catholic religious background, albeit there are exceptions to that generalisation.) At the same time, given England is 85% of the population, the boundary between "British nationalism" and "English nationalism" is often quite vague. Its boundaries with Scottish nationalism, Welsh nationalism, Irish nationalism, tend to be more clearly cut.
- tzs 5y agoWould it have better fit in with those layers if instead of voting on the UK leaving the EU they had instead voted on England leaving the UK?
- ytwySXpMbS 5y agoI don’t think England would ever leave the UK, as English people view England as the main UK country. Also, the EU has been blamed for decades as a scapegoat, whereas the UK definitely hasn’t.
- Nursie 5y agoOver half of the Welsh population votes for Brexit. A third of Scots did. Without those votes the UK would not have left the EU. The idea it is purely an English phenomenon is divisive and pernicious.
- skissane 5y ago> Over half of the Welsh population votes for Brexit Many of the residents of Wales who voted for Brexit are English: https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2019/sep/22/english-people-wales-brexit-research https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2019/sep/22/english-peop... The areas of Wales which identify the most strongly as Welsh had the some of the lowest votes for Brexit.
- Nursie 5y agoSo we can cut it along perceived ethnic lines too? This is just more pernicious divisiveness. Those areas that are most Welsh also voted in significant numbers for Brexit. The people of the UK, in various proportions in various places, voted to leave the EU. It may suck, but pretending it’s purely an English problem is delusion. If you want someone to blame, blame the people that voted for Brexit everywhere. This exoneration of particular regions is bizarre. How can it be all about English Nationalism when a third of Scots voted that way too?
- dijit 5y agoBritish nationalism is built on building things up as British not tearing things down as unBritish. “‘Cor tea and digestives on a rainy day, what could be more british” National identity precludes other nationalities, which is largely the impetus for Brexit. Brits are not ever blamed for being unBritish, even if they don’t like football.
- mattmanser 5y agoThat's not true, we regularly judge people not doing things the 'right' way, but we just don't use the term 'un-British'. It's hard to explain, but there are code-phrases that some use like 'its not the done thing', or 'they're not our sort of people'. Supporting football's not really 'British', and a fairly modern phenomenon. In the 80s it was deemed uncouth and heavily associated with hooliganism, but rehabilitated in the 90s, and is already falling out of fashion again. Football support is heavily wrapped up in the complicated British classes, in the 90s/00s it was cool to pretend to be working class when you were middle class, and supporting football was a visible way of doing that.
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- contradict 5y agoThey did it to avoid being replaced by immigrants which isn't specific to Britain - it's more like European nationalism.
- andrepd 5y ago> How else would you explain brexit? The economy. I'm sure there's an undercurrent of xenophobia and "little England"-ism which explains it, but it's not the full picture. Probably the biggest factor is that neoliberalism has been fucking working class people over since Thatcher. It's (sadly) empirically demonstrated that economic hardship pushes people to right-wing populism (see the 1930s, and the 2010s). Marx was right, history is moved by the material conditions of people (not fully, but in large part).
- jeofken 5y agoTo clarify the point, when other Swedes act a little “unswedish” it may be cosmopolitan cool, but it is limited to the national/ethnic in group. When Arabs, Somalians, or Nigerians, or other foreign peoples act unswedish its expected, and if loud, an annoyance
- gradschoolfail 5y agoDitto for “unamerican”. To call a Russian immigrant unamerican would get one mystified looks at best, probably.
- IncRnd 5y ago> It’s rare to hear someone accused of being un-Swedish or un-British—but un-American is a common slur, slung by both left and right against the other. Being called un-American is like being called “un-Christian” or “un-Islamic,” a charge akin to heresy. People may be called un-American as a political weapon, but that's about all it is. People in politics use all sorts of childish phrases as weapons. In reality I've never been called un-American or seen another person called un-American, unless it was for humor.
- deleted 5y ago[deleted]
- FpUser 5y agoLong time ago I was accused of being "un-Canadian(TM)" by neighbor because I do not watch hockey. Actually I do not watch sports at all but it did not matter to him. God knows what would've happened had I admitted not pouring maple syrup on my morning eggs and bacon.
- rootusrootus 5y ago> had I admitted not pouring maple syrup on my morning eggs and bacon. That sounds tasty. Can I be an honorary Canadian?
- FpUser 5y agoEwww ;) I hate mixing salt and sweets.
- Igelau 5y agoHeads up: that's probably peameal back bacon and not the pork belly bacon you're expecting.
- FpUser 5y agoSorry to disappoint. Just your regular pork belly bacon. Old style thick slices. Anyways being way older I am now more into BBQ and veggies.
- ryanbrunner 5y agoBelly bacon strips are far more popular than peameal in Canada. Peameal for sure exists (unlike American "Canadian Bacon"), but 90% of people still have bacon that would be normal bacon to an American. If you go to a Canadian diner and order "bacon" unqualified, you'll get strips of belly bacon.
- geodel 5y agoCould you just get away by telling you are contributing your share to strategic reserve[1] to stabilize price for all Canadians. That would be very patriotic thing to do :-) 1. https://www.vpr.org/post/inside-global-strategic-maple-syrup-reserve https://www.vpr.org/post/inside-global-strategic-maple-syrup...
- pjc50 5y agoThe mandatory for immigration "life in the UK" test is basically a Buzzfeed "how British are you" test made legally binding. Unbritishness definitely gets thrown around, especially these days.
- Brakenshire 5y agoThat test is basically just memorising a leaflet of facts and figures. It’s not to be taken seriously one way or the other.
- bluthru 5y ago>In fact to be unswedish is not just a common idiom it’s a positive one. It’s when you don’t show the typical negative Swedishness. You aren’t “accused” of it, you are congratulated. One wonders how a people reaches this level of demoralization.
- grecy 5y agoOne political party in Australia tried to adopt this and starting calling people "un-Australian". The leader of the other party stood up and tore him to shreds, saying that the magic of Australia is that it's a country of immigrants and that by very definition, everyone there is Australian. It's perfectly fine to disagree about stuff and have discussions, but we're all still Australian. Anyone who says otherwise is trying to tear the country apart and should never be given a microphone again. The other guy has never tried that childish divisive tactic again.
- stubish 5y agoUnaustralian is reasonably common, used as a slur by both sides of politics, the same as described in the article. Tends to be called out with accusations of jingoism in the mud flinging though, which might make it different.
- mmsimanga 5y agoAs a black man I have been called unblack plenty times when my views differed. It's a pretty effective slur that leads to one keeping their opinion to themselves.